Hello guys!

 

In these days I'm seeing multiple police agencies in the United States dumping the well-known Ford Crown Victoria, replacing it with cars such as Ford Taurus, Ford Explorer or the brand new Dodge Charger. But many people, especially the one who are/were in the police said that the Crown Vic is definitely better on various aspects, including reliability and durability.

I don't live in the US but I'm basing off on fonts such as the latest police chases on YouTube (like the ones from wwwy2000, for example), and it looks like the Crown Vic, after 3 decades of duty, is almost to the point of dying. Especially when it comes to city police departments like NYPD, because I think the Crown Vic is better for highway chase while cars such as Taurus or Charger are better for a chase in the city. Although there are also state police agencies, like CHP that is going to stick more on the Charger rather that the Crown Vic. Personally, I think it's most American car you could ever see in the American police, and I wouldn't be surprised if it will be missed.

But given the fact that everyone has its thoughts on this car on every aspect, my question is: in these 3 decades of duty, was the Ford Crown Victoria the best car the police ever had? I'm curious to know your opinions too.

Edited August 26, 20178 yr by badass22

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

 

But a majority of people consider it to be among the best service cars ever designed. It was roomy, it was cheap, it was durable (and predictable as to what was going to break), and easy to work on. They were also slower than they should have been in the later generation (Ford should have upped the horsepower), and the handling was okay for a large car. Those were the two primary negatives. And they sure as hell didn't look new, either. They kept the same appearance from 1998 to 2011. If you tell someone that you own a 2011 Crown Victoria, they would most likely ask "Ford made 2011 Crown Vics!?!?" 

 

Ford chose to neglect the car due to a global shift in increasing SUV sales and smaller FWD/AWD sedans.

 

I know someone who runs a livery service with Lincoln Town Cars (same car, different badge) that put 500,000 miles on the original engine and transmission, other than replacing an intake manifold (they're notorious for leaking after abuse), and timing chains. They were also great taxi cabs after police service. 

But the main thing is, most of its buyers were fleet buyers (90% in fact in the final model years). The general public did not want the car after the early-mid 2000's (other than the large cult following crowd it has in the United States and elsewhere). That's because it was incredibly outdated. If Ford did update it, I'd imagine it would of had more respectable sales figures compared to the 1980's and 1990's (the best decades for the panther platform in terms of sales).

 

A lot of people here will agree with me, a lot of people will disagree with me. Some people will say the Taurus looks better, the Charger looks cooler, but I can confidently tell you that mechanically speaking (if we're going by engine break-down, straight forward reliability and cost effectiveness) the Crown Vic wins hands down.

 

I'm going to do this using facts, not opinion. It used a cast iron block, low compression V8 engine. Something that is extinct. All newer engines use aluminum. Cast iron is significantly more durable, at the cost of displacing less heat and being heavier. A Ford engineer actually told me this (I knew it before, but he reinforced it). Newer engines will often use cast iron in critical areas, and aluminum in other areas, but it's not really the same.

 

 The lower compression ratio means the engine isn't going to be stressed, in comparison to a twin-turbo high compression EcoBoost engine. The transmissions are composed of 4 gears, significantly less moving parts to fail than your new run of the mill 8-speed automatic. The car rests on a body-on-frame platform, built in the same manner as many full-sized pickup trucks and SUV's. This allows for easier repairs after collisions. Yes, the car uses 1970's technology and design. But after reading this post, maybe 1970's technology is better for police work after all? Think about it.

 

I can't sit here and tell you with a smug face that it was the best car ever made, that would be ignorant. But I can sure as hell tell you it's one of the best cars ever made.  Every cop I have talked to told me they liked the Crown Victoria better, especially here in Connecticut. Almost 6 years after discontinuation, it's still the second most common police car here in the state next to the Ford Explorer. That has to say something. And we're a rich state with huge police budgets, plenty of room to buy tons of new cars... but they seem to be holding on.

 

 

48 minutes ago, Original Light said:

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

 

But a majority of people consider it to be among the best service cars ever designed. It was roomy, it was cheap, it was durable (and predictable as to what was going to break), and easy to work on. They were also slower than they should have been in the later generation (Ford should have upped the horsepower), and the handling was okay for a large car. Those were the two primary negatives. And they sure as hell didn't look new, either. They kept the same appearance from 1998 to 2011. If you tell someone that you own a 2011 Crown Victoria, they would most likely ask "Ford made 2011 Crown Vics!?!?" 

 

Ford chose to neglect the car due to a global shift in increasing SUV sales and smaller FWD/AWD sedans.

 

I know someone who runs a livery service with Lincoln Town Cars (same car, different badge) that put 500,000 miles on the original engine and transmission, other than replacing an intake manifold (they're notorious for leaking after abuse), and timing chains. They were also great taxi cabs after police service. 

But the main thing is, most of its buyers were fleet buyers (90% in fact in the final model years). The general public did not want the car after the early-mid 2000's (other than the large cult following crowd it has in the United States and elsewhere). That's because it was incredibly outdated. If Ford did update it, I'd imagine it would of had more respectable sales figures compared to the 1980's and 1990's (the best decades for the panther platform in terms of sales).

 

A lot of people here will agree with me, a lot of people will disagree with me. Some people will say the Taurus looks better, the Charger looks cooler, but I can confidently tell you that mechanically speaking (if we're going by engine break-down, straight forward reliability and cost effectiveness) the Crown Vic wins hands down.

 

I'm going to do this using facts, not opinion. It used a cast iron, low compression V8 engine. Something that is extinct. All newer engines use aluminum. Cast iron is significantly more durable, at the cost of displacing less heat and being heavier. A Ford engineer actually told me this (I knew it before, but he reinforced it). Newer engines will often use cast iron in critical areas, and aluminum in other areas, but it's not really the same.

 

 The lower compression ratio means the engine isn't going to be stressed, in comparison to a twin-turbo high compression EcoBoost engine. The transmissions are composed of 4 gears, significantly less moving parts to fail than your new run of the mill 8-speed automatic. The car rests on a body-on-frame platform, built in the same manner as many full-sized pickup trucks and SUV's. This allows for easier repairs after collisions. Yes, the car uses 1970's technology and design. But after reading this post, maybe 1970's technology is better for police work after all? Think about it.

 

I can't sit here and tell you with a smug face that it was the best car ever made, that would be ignorant. But I can sure as hell tell you it's one of the best cars ever made.  Every cop I have talked to told me they liked the Crown Victoria better, especially here in Connecticut. Almost 6 years after discontinuation, it's still the second most common police car here in the state next to the Ford Explorer. That has to say something. And we're a rich state with huge police budgets, plenty of room to buy tons of new cars... but they seem to be holding on.

 

 

You explained why many people prefer the CVPI over FPIS, FPIU and Dodge Charger. The CVPI was build basically to last, that's why after 3 decades it's still used by police or taxi agencies. I think that if the newer cars, like the other cited along with the CVPI, break down more frequently, it's also because some companies today make them appositely to get more money from their customers. For example, if your car breaks down, the money you spend to repair it go to the manufacturing company, and so the more it breaks down, the more you have to spend to repair it, buy replacement part, and more money the company gets. It's a strategy they picked to get richer, maybe to deal with the financial crysis, I don't know to be honest, but I'm sure of what the companies are doing because this happens to newer cars, and that's why some people prefer older cars.

 

Maybe if Ford just made a facelift on the Crown Vic, it would be still on production.

Edited August 26, 20178 yr by badass22

1 hour ago, badass22 said:

You explained why many people prefer the CVPI over FPIS, FPIU and Dodge Charger. The CVPI was build basically to last, that's why after 3 decades it's still used by police or taxi agencies. I think that if the newer cars, like the other cited along with the CVPI, break down more frequently, it's also because some companies today make them appositely to get more money from their customers. For example, if your car breaks down, the money you spend to repair it go to the manufacturing company, and so the more it breaks down, the more you have to spend to repair it, buy replacement part, and more money the company gets. It's a strategy they picked to get richer, maybe to deal with the financial crysis, I don't know to be honest, but I'm sure of what the companies are doing because this happens to newer cars, and that's why some people prefer older cars.

 

Maybe if Ford just made a facelift on the Crown Vic, it would be still on production.

I doubt that it would be, if they did update it it would have not been very similar to what it was. If I remember correctly it was discontinued due to a federal law that all 2012 model year cars had to have standard traction control, which the vic did not.

1 hour ago, Original Light said:

Every cop I have talked to told me they liked the Crown Victoria better, especially here in Connecticut. Almost 6 years after discontinuation, it's still the second most common police car here in the state next to the Ford Explorer. That has to say something. And we're a rich state with huge police budgets, plenty of room to buy tons of new cars... but they seem to be holding on.

 

This is my sentiment as well. Most cops I have ever talked to had the same things to say about the Vic, they dislike the other cars in their fleet and miss the Vic. One thing that they never liked was it's speed, but overall they liked it. My hometown recently got a shipment of Caprices and 2016/2017 FPIUs. They don't like them. There's still 4 Vics left in that department and they won't let them go.

It's sad when you think about it, the end of the Vic was the end of an era of service vehicles. I remember when the 1998-2000 Vic was slowly replacing all of the '96s and Caprices around me. It was slick looking and you'd see it everywhere. The problem now is, nothing really took the Vics place. So many departments have so many different vehicles. Part of that is to keep repair costs down and also have some of your fleet still paroling, but not one department really relies on one single vehicle type anymore. Ford neglected to fully replace the Vic. Was it a huge misstep? You betcha. Now Dodge and Chevy snuck in and stole a lot of Fords market share. Now they're trying to recoup with the FPIU/FPIS/Responder cars.

Makes me sad, it was a true end of an era. No one was or probably ever will be as popular as the Vic was.

The Ford Fusion Hybrid Police Responder sedan may be good for very liberal cities like New York City and Los Angeles that want to drink the Democrat Party's Kool-Aid, but I doubt the cops will like those very much. The F150 Police Package is something I do agree with, I believe that goes on sale next year.

 

The future of the Taurus is in the air. It may be discontinued, according to recent articles. Sales keep going down. I imagine they may still produce it for fleet only in the near future, like the Vic was fleet only 2007-2011. 

30 minutes ago, Original Light said:

The Ford Fusion Hybrid Police Responder sedan may be good for very liberal cities like New York City and Los Angeles that want to drink the Democrat Party's Kool-Aid, but I doubt the cops will like those very much. The F150 Police Package is something I do agree with, I believe that goes on sale next year.

 

The future of the Taurus is in the air. It may be discontinued, according to recent articles. Sales keep going down. I imagine they may still produce it for fleet only in the near future, like the Vic was fleet only 2007-2011. 

 

What does being liberal have to do with a hybrid police car? NY has had hybrid fusions for almost a decade and the cops dont care at all. am I just confused what your point is?

FUK THE VIC

34 minutes ago, Original Light said:

The Ford Fusion Hybrid Police Responder sedan may be good for very liberal cities like New York City and Los Angeles that want to drink the Democrat Party's Kool-Aid, but I doubt the cops will like those very much. The F150 Police Package is something I do agree with, I believe that goes on sale next year.

 

The future of the Taurus is in the air. It may be discontinued, according to recent articles. Sales keep going down. I imagine they may still produce it for fleet only in the near future, like the Vic was fleet only 2007-2011. 

Fairly certain the Ford Fusion Responder was made specifically for cities already using the hybrid vehicles (Like NYPD since around '09) but aren't pursuit rated. Less to do with "drinking the Democrat[ic] party's Kool-aid" and more to do with reaching a new market and providing for said market. Plus, they are fuel efficient which I am sure saves departments as large as NYPD loads of cash. I don't know about you, but I haven't really seen a lot of cops upset about what car they are driving, in fact I doubt most of them know the differences between an explorer and an FPIU.

 

I doubt the Taurus will continue, the FPIU is just a superior car. Doesn't make sense for a department to use both. The F150 is good in concept, but it seems impractical for any department with a population larger than 100. Other than being a special use vehicle I don't see it becoming any more popular than it is already.

Just speaking from experience I love the new Taurus, but they are cramped. I find myself getting uncomfortable during the shift.

IMO nothing will ever be as iconic as the CVPI. I live in Austraila so I've never seen one personly (closest I can get is an early Avalon) but in every TV/Moive I've watch, even newer ones they always use CVPI. It's what people know as a cop car. nothing can ever replace it as company's change body ever few years but the CVPI stayed mostly the same for over 10 and built up that image. 

15 hours ago, badass22 said:

Hello guys!

 

In these days I'm seeing multiple police agencies in the United States dumping the well-known Ford Crown Victoria, replacing it with cars such as Ford Taurus, Ford Explorer or the brand new Dodge Charger. But many people, especially the one who are/were in the police said that the Crown Vic is definitely better on various aspects, including reliability and durability.

I don't live in the US but I'm basing off on fonts such as the latest police chases on YouTube (like the ones from wwwy2000, for example), and it looks like the Crown Vic, after 3 decades of duty, is almost to the point of dying. Especially when it comes to city police departments like NYPD, because I think the Crown Vic is better for highway chase while cars such as Taurus or Charger are better for a chase in the city. Although there are also state police agencies, like CHP that is going to stick more on the Charger rather that the Crown Vic. Personally, I think it's most American car you could ever see in the American police, and I wouldn't be surprised if it will be missed.

But given the fact that everyone has its thoughts on this car on every aspect, my question is: in these 3 decades of duty, was the Ford Crown Victoria the best car the police ever had? I'm curious to know your opinions too.

They are great cars but since ford no longer makes them then they really have no choice but to upgrade.  It was more of Ford's doing that agencies get rid of them because eventually they are gonna die, no more new parts or anything like that. 

 

Take my agency I'm with for example.  All full time officers have the chargers now.  There is only one person that still drives a crown Vic and that's one of our srgts because he hates the chargers. 

 

The only other folks in our agency that drive crown vics are the reserves along with a few impala and honestly I prefer the crown Vic over the chargers.  A lot more roomy inside of them.  Unlike the charges you feel so confined and squished with that laptop and everything else.

The Crown Vic is roomy as all hell, reliable due to its simplicity and steadfast design, and takes off like a shot thanks to that V8.  They feel larger on the inside and significantly less cramped than comparable Tauruses and Chargers for sure, and their trunk space is unparalleled.   They might not be the quickest, and they might not corner the best at higher speeds, but they did their job for the better half of thirty years, and were good enough during that time to establish fond memories from those who drove them.  

 

I personally prefer the way the Vic handles as compared to anything else currently offered.  The Taurus and Charger are definitely quicker, but their interior visibility is downright poor compared to the CVPI.  I also prefer the conservative styling of the Crown Victoria - it didn't look aggressive in the least bit, more so administrative, but it most definitely had a presence on the road.

 

I doubt you could nail a specific car down to the "best police car ever", given that the variety of memories, experiences, and technical details will point to every end of the spectrum, but the Crown Vic represents the last of its kind in a way.  The last body-on-frame, RWD, V8-powered sedan that has the proportions of a shipping vessel and the handling and interior volume to match (along with bench seating options and the column shifter standard!).  In the long line of police cars like the Dodge Monaco/Plymouth Fury, Chevy Caprice, Ford Custom and LTD II, among countless others, the Crown Victoria personifies the zenith of decades of traditional policing.  

 

All I know for sure is that once mine inevitably rusts out from under me thanks to New England winters (RWD and snow offer an interesting time, haha) and lack of anything but on-street parking, I'm sure that I'll be picking up another (or Grand Marquis) in the future.  Hopefully by then I'll have a garage and a separate winter car!

 

--------------------------

 

18 hours ago, thegreathah said:

Fairly certain the Ford Fusion Responder was made specifically for cities already using the hybrid vehicles (Like NYPD since around '09) but aren't pursuit rated. Less to do with "drinking the Democrat[ic] party's Kool-aid" and more to do with reaching a new market and providing for said market. Plus, they are fuel efficient which I am sure saves departments as large as NYPD loads of cash. I don't know about you, but I haven't really seen a lot of cops upset about what car they are driving, in fact I doubt most of them know the differences between an explorer and an FPIU.

 

I doubt the Taurus will continue, the FPIU is just a superior car. Doesn't make sense for a department to use both. The F150 is good in concept, but it seems impractical for any department with a population larger than 100. Other than being a special use vehicle I don't see it becoming any more popular than it is already.

 

I'm looking forward to seeing how the Responder does in police service.  I've heard anecdotally that the NYPD Fusions didn't stand up very well to the rigors of being run 24/7, and weren't exactly comfortable given their narrow interior dimensions.

 

I would disagree that the Utility is superior to the Taurus though.  I'd like to imagine that the Taurus comes out cheaper on a per-unit basis as compared to a Utility, and numerous departments don't really need the extra cargo room of an SUV.  Part of the issue is how cramped Ford managed to make the Taurus' interior as compared to how large of a car it is IMO.

Edited August 27, 20178 yr by FCV96

2 hours ago, FCV96 said:

I'm looking forward to seeing how the Responder does in police service.  I've heard anecdotally that the NYPD Fusions didn't stand up very well to the rigors of being run 24/7, and weren't exactly comfortable given their narrow interior dimensions.

 

I actually agree they dont look as comfortable, and exterior wise look a lot more run down than the other cars in the fleet, but they are the oldest cars in the fleet and will be phased out regardless eventually. They did just put exterior bulletproof panels on them though (and all the other cars) so maybe they are around for the long haul? 

21 minutes ago, t0y said:

 

I actually agree they dont look as comfortable, and exterior wise look a lot more run down than the other cars in the fleet, but they are the oldest cars in the fleet and will be phased out regardless eventually. They did just put exterior bulletproof panels on them though (and all the other cars) so maybe they are around for the long haul? 

 

Maybe, although I haven't seen any marked Fusions newer than 2014, and generally the marked cars tend to stick around 3-5 years from what I've seen from my local precinct.   

I'm just gonna put it simple. The CVPI is simply an iconic police/taxi car. Within its era nothing could really beat this car. 

 

And yes sometimes all good things come to an end (due to the shutdown of the St Thomas plant in Ontario). Our local department is replacing them with Ford F150's as the sergeant vehicles while the rest are gonna be standard Ford Police Interceptor Utilities, Chevy Tahoes, and a few Taurses as unmarked cars. Our provincial police still uses CVPI as a stockpile but new 2016 Chargers are making its way into the department as well as some Tauruses. CVPI's still greatly exist in Toronto, due to the citizens hating the new Taurus repaint design.

Edited September 23, 20178 yr by SCPDUnit23

Sometimes I also take cars like Taurus, Explorer and Charger, just to use something different. But after all, for being a car that is made to outlast the guy you're going to chase, that's why I always select the CVPI when playing on LSPDFR.

I drove a Crown Vic once or twice before getting into LE. They were fast and fun but not overly practical up north where I live and work. Would be cool to see them make a come back but they definitely would need some major updating at this point.

 

Otherwise, since I've started in law enforcement my experience has been mostly with the new Taurus and with the newer Tahoes. We had the 8 of the Taurus Interceptors at the academy, they were fast and maneuverable but as was mentioned they're fairly small, even for a smaller guy like me. Otherwise on the job I've been driving a newer (2015 I think) Tahoe SSV and have loved it. It's got 4WD when I need it (don't need it much in the city except after snow storms), otherwise it's got some good giddy-up and has plenty of space for me. Taken a little getting used to the size on narrower city streets but otherwise I like it.

CVPI was the best, hands down. Like it was previously stated, they definitely were not the fastest nor the best handling, but they were dependable battle cruisers. Ford had a vast majority of the market for police and other fleet vehicles and should not have stopped making them. I think a large part of the reason was that they hadn't had any real changes or updates and pretty much stayed the same since they changed the body style in the early 2000's. Newer cars like the Impala/Caprice and Taurus are smaller, less dependable, and cramped inside if you're above average height. Wouldn't mind having a hemi Charger to play around in because they are supposed to fly. Currently I am in a Tahoe, so I can't complain about the space and it has decent speed for such a big vehicle. 

On 8/26/2017 at 1:47 PM, Mags said:

Just speaking from experience I love the new Taurus, but they are cramped. I find myself getting uncomfortable during the shift.

  That's why I have been advocating for Buick to make police cruisers or Lincoln Towncars.  Yea they are expensive, but when it comes to space, nothing beats it.  But with the Buick, the officer's might not be able to find it since apparently no one knows what one looks like.