Looks like they Waco'd him.

 

If Dorner became a crispy critter I'm not gonna lose any sleep over it.

 

That's what I thought as soon as the cabin started on flames. I guess it might be true that the tear gas can cause fires...

 

Seems they had found a carbonized body, they have to identify it, but it's probably it's Dorner.

Was anyone listening to the police scanner? Its being reported that LAPD started the blaze:

 

http://gawker.com/5983900/cops-accused-of-starting-fire-as-charred-body-found-in-dorner-cabin

 

Includes a link to the recording of the police chatter:

 

All right, Steve, we're gonna go, er, we're gonna go forward with the
plan, with, er, with the burn. We want it, er, like we talked about.
[...] Seven burners deployed and we have a fire.

While it seems logical that it was a ploy to do this to push him out, it seems rather unorthodox, do you agree?

Edited February 13, 201313 yr by DLer

Seems like a pretty dumb move by the cops.  Ordering the media to clear out, then giving the order to torch the cabin ("go ahead with the burn like we talked about") doesn't seem like a very good way to reassure the public that you've moved on and all of that stuff like Charlie Beck and the others have been claiming.  They all so desperately want the public to have confidence in the police, but I'm not sure how they can when they are breaking the law themselves with arson and murder.  It's annoying that people support him (I don't really think you can support him if he kills people himself) but I think its easier to see why now, given that the cops are making themselves quite hard to support as well.  I don't really think anybody is upset that he's gone after the people he killed, but then again it looks like the police have just done an execution job themselves which is just the wrong way to end this, considering that the higher ups in the LAPD said they wanted it to end without anyone else dying - looks like they lied if an order was given to execute him.

Apparently he fled the cabin as the tear gas entered and hijacked a white pickup truck, the body may well be of the hostage / owner of the cabin as there were reports of a single gunshot just before the cabin went up in flames.

Apparently he fled the cabin as the tear gas entered and hijacked a white pickup truck, the body may well be of the hostage / owner of the cabin as there were reports of a single gunshot just before the cabin went up in flames.

 

 

From what the LA Times is reporting, he had previously broke into a different cabin a couple days ago, and held a couple hostage. The white pickup truck was a vehicle that he was spotted in, then drove towards the cabin he was holed up and crashed:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2013/02/dorner-shootout-big-bear-hundreds-shots.html

 

 

The owner of the cabin was called live on the air during Anderson Cooper's report last night, so rule that out:

 

http://ktla.com/2013/02/13/owner-of-cabin-used-as-dorners-hideout-talks-about-shocking-standoff/

 

The body has not been identified. Until then police remain on alert. I am hard pressed to believe he could have escaped, but we will have to wait for the results of the autopsy.

Edited February 13, 201313 yr by DLer

Apparently he fled the cabin as the tear gas entered and hijacked a white pickup truck, the body may well be of the hostage / owner of the cabin as there were reports of a single gunshot just before the cabin went up in flames.

I was thinking the same thing. Because if this guy has the training that they say he has, he may have just killed someone else and dumped their body in the cabin to get the cops tied up for a little while so he has more time to flee. But, no one knows until the DNA reports come back.

Not surprised it was torched as thats the good ol LAPD for you.

However, I had heard many times that they were not involved up there...It was being handled by Riverside PD and the San Bernadino Sheriff. Did the Sheriff Department give them permission to come?

 

 

BTW, Funeral service for officer killed last week by Dorner.

(Father of a three year old girl,husband, son, grandson) His whole family is there. The church filled up so they started a jumbotron section down the road for the other 1000 or so....

Watch here:

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/live-video/

Not surprised it was torched as thats the good ol LAPD for you.

However, I had heard many times that they were not involved up there...It was being handled by Riverside PD and the San Bernadino Sheriff. Did the Sheriff Department give them permission to come?

 

 

BTW, Funeral service for officer killed last week by Dorner.

(Father of a three year old girl,husband, son, grandson) His whole family is there. The church filled up so they started a jumbotron section down the road for the other 1000 or so....

Watch here:

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/live-video/

The LAPD, as well as other PD's in California, have jurisdiction over the whole state

The LAPD, as well as other PD's in California, have jurisdiction over the whole state

Yes I realize that but if you listen to the press releases and updates given by LAPD commanders time and time again, they had said that this is the San Bernadino Sheriff's operation and they were waiting for approval by the Sheriff to join in the standoff. 

Was anyone listening to the police scanner? Its being reported that LAPD started the blaze:

 

http://gawker.com/5983900/cops-accused-of-starting-fire-as-charred-body-found-in-dorner-cabin

 

Includes a link to the recording of the police chatter:

 

While it seems logical that it was a ploy to do this to push him out, it seems rather unorthodox, do you agree?

 

The reports of him fleeing are false for who ever said that. But you have to look at it how they looked at it.

 

How many officers could die trying to storm that cabin and get him out?

 

Would you rather have 5 officers dead or 1 cop killer dead?

Man I am so glad that this guy is dead, thank you police, you have been great in this situation.

Man I am so glad that this guy is dead, thank you police, you have been great in this situation.

He's not dead until we see the DNA results of the charred corpse found at the scene, given his training, it could be a decoy.

 

Nicolai forwarded this to me earlier which puts this guys actions into perspective:

 

 

 I know two former LAPD officers, one who was in the academy with Dorner, the other did probation at Harbor division with him. They both said he was a total screw up. He shot himself in the hand in the academy. Understand that you rarely get terminated over one incident. It is a build up of poor performance reviews by multiple FTO's (Field Training Officers). The incident that got Dorner fired was just the last straw. Interesting that he doesn't tell anyone about this misconduct until he learns he is about to be fired. To me the system worked and a he was fired on probation. The question for me is how he passed his psych exam.

Man I am so glad that this guy is dead, thank you police, you have been great in this situation.

The police havent been great in this situation.

While yea they got the job done maybe. 

They shot I believe three innocent people(killing one).

Harassed anybody somewhat meeting his description...

Nothing

to sympathize with.  If you do, there is something seriously wrong with

you.  He murdered innocent people...a young girl and her boyfriend, she

was the daughter of his attorney I believe.  

 

Good day,

 

DrDetroit

 

The guy was trying to make something right; he was trying to re instill integrity and honour into a profession that has since been scruntized

every day by cops that he was trying to fight against.

 

Am I condoning his actions? no, as I mentioned he could have used other means or avenues to approach this subject directly. The fact that he killed innocent people goes against every moral values that have been taught to those in the military. I understand his mentality but disagree with his tactics.

 

This "Thin Blue Line" is a toxic poison that has infiltrated every level of management within the majority of large metropolitan police departments. Chris Dorner was merely trying to expose this corruption that has turned cops into the very people they were sworn to put behind bars.

 

He's not dead until we see the DNA results of the charred corpse found at the scene, given his training, it could be a decoy.

 

Nicolai forwarded this to me earlier which puts this guys actions into perspective:

 

 

 I know two former LAPD officers, one who was in the academy with Dorner, the other did probation at Harbor division with him. They both said he was a total screw up. He shot himself in the hand in the academy. Understand that you rarely get terminated over one incident. It is a build up of poor performance reviews by multiple FTO's (Field Training Officers). The incident that got Dorner fired was just the last straw. Interesting that he doesn't tell anyone about this misconduct until he learns he is about to be fired. To me the system worked and a he was fired on probation. The question for me is how he passed his psych exam.

That's going to happen; your gonna have people say bad things about a guy who just committed a crime. A "friend" of mine was fired and terminated by the Police Force that I had worked with, from guys that I knew in his Division they said great things about him before he was terminated; after he was terminated they reversed what they said and labelled him a "screw up in training" and "failure".

Another two of my former co-workers were also terminated by the same Force again people were saying great things about them BEFORE they were terminated, afterwards however they went on to say that they were incompetent, lazy and a complete f*** up.

Actually the incident in question had been reported by Dorner before he was terminated, even the guy's father put in a complaint against the Officer in question.

 

 

 

 

Seems like a pretty dumb move by the cops.  Ordering the media to clear out, then giving the order to torch the cabin ("go ahead with the burn like

we talked about") doesn't seem like a very good way to reassure the public that you've moved on and all of that stuff like Charlie Beck and the others have been claiming.  They all so desperately want the public to have confidence in the police, but I'm not sure how they can when

they are breaking the law themselves with arson and murder.  It's annoying that people support him (I don't really think you can support

him if he kills people himself) but I think its easier to see why now, given that the cops are making themselves quite hard to support as well.

 I don't really think anybody is upset that he's gone after the people he killed, but then again it looks like the police have just done an

execution job themselves which is just the wrong way to end this, considering that the higher ups in the LAPD said they wanted it to end

without anyone else dying - looks like they lied if an order was given to execute him.

 

 

That's the thing, a lot of people have a negative image of law enforcement due to the fact that there are officers whom abuse their powers; thinking just because they have a gun, badge and a uniform they are above the law and are god. I've seen this type of attitude and behaviour and quite honest I was disgusted that these people are "Protecting and Serving". Sure many officer's do the job because they want to make a difference but more often than not the one's whom Chris Dorner was talking about

in his manifesto are the ones that most people see.

The issue of Police brutality and Cops over stepping their boundaries was bound to blow up. Look at it from an OBJECTIVE stand point, you have the MCSO losing their "Federal" status because they were basically harassing every Mexican they could find; You have the Seattle Police Department being investigated by the DOJ for violating CIVIL RIGHTS; You have the Anaheim Police

Department being investigated for shooting four people; You have the Toronto Police Service being hammered for its treatment of the mentally ill, pay and abuse; You have the RCMP under the microscope for violating the Charter, Abusing their rights and discrimination within their own ranks, I mean the list goes on. It was bound to happen at some point. So for people supporting Chris Dorner and the points that he brought out in his manifesto, it's not so hard to believe at all.

 

Again I'm not condoning his actions, I don't think anyone in their right mind would support a guy who killed innocent people; they are supporting the points that the manifesto brought out and supporting the fact that the issue of Police Brutality and the "Thin Blue Line" has been put on the fore front. Charlie Beck even stated that the LAPD was re-opening the claims that he made. For those who say "Oh well, the Thin Blue Line is something that cops can fall back on because of what they see and deal with" Yes, it was created for the mere fact of talking with, counseling and the peer-support of other cops NOT using it to perjure yourself and lying about beating the sh** out of a completely innocent person. 

 

As for the actions of the Police in the stand-off, I don't think they actually had a choice. I mean it was either risk losing 20 guys in an assault or burn the place down; given they could have negotiated with him but he made it pretty clear that he was going to die in a hail of bullets.

 

Edited February 13, 201313 yr by Comm

Here's scanner audio that talks about "proceed with the burn" and "seven burners in position".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0tK09NNFfI

Nothing to sympathize with.  If you do, there is something seriously wrong with you.  He murdered innocent people...a young girl and her boyfriend, she was the daughter of his attorney I believe.  

 

Good day,

 

DrDetroit

 

Adding on to what to Comm said, Chris Dorner was not really a "bad" guy. All of Dorner's friends said he was fun, intelligent, well-liked, etc. He was merely trying to expose the LAPD's corruptness and as a result got fired by a corrupt Captain. Unfortunately some police departments are just that way. If you really worked for that department, you would see the corruption. The dad of the victim who was faced kicked by Dorner's FTO said there were clear marks on the left of his son's face when he came home that night. No police officer wants to be labeled a snitch by their colleagues and get fired. Dorner stood up and as a result was fired. Think about it, when he car jacked the guy with the white pickup truck, he said he did not want to hurt him. If Dorner shot and killed him, there would be no 911 call and he would have been able to escape. He was not the type to kill random innocent civilians. He could have done much worse things, look at all the recent shootings. Of course this was not the right way to handle it, but consider things from his perspective.

Edited February 13, 201313 yr by DeluxeBrian

Adding on to what to Comm said, Chris Dorner was not really a "bad" guy. All of Dorner's friends said he was fun, intelligent, well-liked, etc. He was merely trying to expose the LAPD's corruptness and as a result got fired by a corrupt Captain. Unfortunately some police departments are just that way. If you really worked for that department, you would see the corruption. The dad of the victim who was faced kicked by Dorner's FTO said there were clear marks on the left of his son's face when he came home that night. No police officer wants to be labeled a snitch by their colleagues and get fired. Dorner stood up and as a result was fired. Think about it, when he car jacked the guy with the white pickup truck, he said he did not want to hurt him. If Dorner shot and killed him, there would be no 911 call and he would have been able to escape. He was not the type to kill random innocent civilians. He could have done much worse things, look at all the recent shootings. Of course, this was not the right way to handle it, but consider things from his perspective.

 

To add; Actually take the time to analyze his manifesto with an Objective perspective, and you'll realize that he does bring up some interesting points.

If the claims that he made turn out to be true, then what does that say about a large Police Department such as LA who were hit hard during the Rodney King episode and hit again with the CRASH episode.

As for those who are about to ask, what do I know about policing. As I mentioned earlier, I have seven years of Military experience; When I transfered into the Reserves I went to school for Criminology whilst working for the Police Service in my city as a member of Court Services (Detentions), HQ Policy staff, Policy staff regarding youth crime and gangs, Worked on a Anti-Gang/Violence unit in some of the worst hit neighbourhoods and was a member of a team that was under the command of the Community Relations Unit. I have worked with cops with both good and bad, and seen the "Thin Blue Line" that Chris Dorner was attempting to uncover. I still hang out with cops, some of my best friends are cops.

I also plan on going back to the Police Force after my contract with the Army expires.

Edited February 13, 201313 yr by Comm

I don't think anyone would challenge your knowledge on what the police force is like, Comm. You're also making a good point about the whole "Yeah, now that he's been fired, I knew all along he was bad" bit. However, from what I saw when I scanned the report of the investigation that led to his firing, he had been told a couple days *before* filing his report that he needed to improve his performance; he was apparently in danger of a negative evaluation.

Also, I'm not quite sure that the father of an alleged victim of police brutality is more objective than the officers involved. Probably not much less objective, but it's really easy to truly believe force used against your kid is unreasonable if it isn't. I'm not saying he would lie about what he saw; it's that interpretation of that wouldn't be unbiased.

Adding on to what to Comm said, Chris Dorner was not really a "bad" guy.....

 

Come on guy!  You gotta be kidding me...not a bad guy??  He is a MURDERER period!  Being a murderer is a bad guy by definition.  So what if he was fun, nice, blah blah blah.  He took innocent lives (I don't give a shit why or what his point was...that is now a mute point because of his actions) and I hate to break it to you, he is a bad guy.  If you don't understand this, you need  to check your premise big time.

 

Good day,

 

DrDetroit

Come on guy!  You gotta be kidding me...not a bad guy??  He is a MURDERER period!  Being a murderer is a bad guy by definition.  So what if he was fun, nice, blah blah blah.  He took innocent lives 

nobody is innocent in this world, i just thought i'd inform you