Considering what Illusionary posted about how many of those shooting have already occurred this year, I'd say this isn't a problem which can be solved by changing gun laws, positioning SWAT teams in schools lobbies, and arming teachers with shotguns. There has got to be a reason why Americans - young Americans - grab a gun and go killing others. 

Considering what Illusionary posted about how many of those shooting have already occurred this year, I'd say this isn't a problem which can be solved by changing gun laws, positioning SWAT teams in schools lobbies, and arming teachers with shotguns. There has got to be a reason why Americans - young Americans - grab a gun and go killing others. 

This this and this. Personally I feel that mental health problems and ease of access to firearms are the problem. Someone who's thinking straight doesn't just wake up one morning and go "huh, I think I'll go slaughter some kids at my local school today". More needs to be done to notice, report and treat mental health issues before they turn violent. Perhaps America could benefit from the Sibyl System...

Here we go again... How long do you think it'll be before people stop arguing firearm control and start citing the lack of available facilities for mental health?

How is it with gun licenses over there? 

It seems like any lunatic can get a gun over there without mental tests and stuff.

I'm pretty sure that here in Sweden, you gotta make some mental test before getting a gun.

And then, why doesn't the all of the United States have some kind of laws requiring guns to be in one of those gun cabinet safes things? 

And then mental help is a big contributor of the firearm thingy. 

How come coworkers, teachers, parents and friends don't notice that someone is turning into a cold-blooded psychopath? 

I am not moving to America, full stop.
But seriously? I know america is a big place, but how can this just go unnoticed before it happened?

I don't agree with your statement "18 is way too young to be able to buy your own handgun(That's the minimum age in Oregon)." Last time i checked the legal age of being a adult is 18, but yet in many states like mine we must be 21 to buy a gun, to drink, to rent a car (actually they want you to be 25), and to even be a cop. What needs to happen is there needs to be a overall set age limit. Now yes, it's a darn shame this thing happened, but i don't think restricting guns from certain people is the correct answer to solve this.

Based on the maturity I have seen from most American teenagers I have seen 18 is way to young for them to be considered adults. I have met very few people under the age of 25 that actually act like responsible adults. Nobody has any reason to own a handgun below the age of 21 or 22.

Based on the maturity I have seen from most American teenagers I have seen 18 is way to young for them to be considered adults. I have met very few people under the age of 25 that actually act like responsible adults. Nobody has any reason to own a handgun below the age of 21 or 22.

Well then the legal adult age needs to be changed to 21. The fact of the matter is if you're an adult you should have the right to own, carry, and purchase a hand gun (it is legal though to purchase and own a long gun such as a shot gun or rifle). Also the same can be said for drinking and so on. Here in the US we make individualizes themselves be held accountable for their own actions, and what they decide to do is all on them. And the whole group (in this case ages 18-20) shouldn't have to be punished for someone else actions and immaturity.

EDIT:

Also does anyone know the exact age of the shooter? Community Colleges are open to all ages, the one i go to has ages of 16-60 years old if not older.

Edited October 3, 201510 yr by MasterTrooper

If most Americans believe that people's actions shouldn't impact others and that the control of guns should not be regulated then nothing changes, everyone sits around talking about how it's sad that there has been another school shooting, yes it's sad. So why do some Americans still refuse to actually do anything about it, do some people believe that it's just going to blow over or what.

 

Well then the legal adult age needs to be changed to 21. The fact of the matter is if you're an adult you should have the right to own, carry, and purchase a hand gun (it is legal though to purchase and own a long gun such as a shot gun or rifle). Also the same can be said for drinking and so on. Here in the US we make individualizes themselves be held accountable for their own actions, and what they decide to do is all on them. And the whole group (in this case ages 18-20) shouldn't have to be punished for someone else actions and immaturity.

EDIT:

Also does anyone know the exact age of the shooter? Community Colleges are open to all ages, the one i go to has ages of 16-60 years old if not older.

Yes I know how things work in America, I'm American I just don't agree with it. Sure you have some people who are mature enough to handle firearms when they are 14 or 15 but personally I don't trust anyone under the age of 25 with a firearm.

If most Americans believe that people's actions shouldn't impact others and that the control of guns should not be regulated then nothing changes, everyone sits around talking about how it's sad that there has been another school shooting, yes it's sad. So why do some Americans still refuse to actually do anything about it, do some people believe that it's just going to blow over or what.

 

Because doing anything to prevent Americans from purchasing, owning, or carrying firearms would be an infringement of our second amendment right. The only time firearms are not allowed are on privately owned property if the owner of that property declares they don't wish for you to have a firearm (this includes residential property and commercial property) guns are also not allowed (in some states) on school property unless locked away. Also carrying a gun doesn't mean you're responsible for protecting others, but it gives you a chance to protect yourself if you fear your life is in danger. Gun control is dependent of each state and each state makes it's own gun laws based on it's peoples decisions, but federal government control over this topic shouldn't be allowed because it wouldn't take into effect the decision of each state and the majority of the people in those states who may not agree with a gun controlling laws passed by the federal government making that law effected everywhere throughout the country, therefore harming their rights to firearms. Now Ben, i know for a fact you're from Britain where firearms are very hard to come by and virtually unseen or allowed except out in the country, so of course you may agree with certain gun control regulations but here in the US we have a certain right to them and those rights allow us to carry and own our firearms. And for people in the US who may think guns are bad or unneeded, that's their belief and if they choose not to own a firearm that's their decision too, but don't infringe on mine or anyone elses rights to firearms.

Now with all this being said the real problem is mental health. People are being diagnosed with mental health disabilities and are being forgotten. Now, convicted felons are not allowed to be in possession, around, or own a firearm....and maybe this should be placed into effect for people who have been diagnosed with mental health problems until they have been cleared and been proven to be psychologically fit to be released from a program, and after that point can purchase or be allowed to reclaim their firearms. But no matter what happens there will be mistakes made in any system and people expect the world to be a safe place, but the fact of the matter is the world will never be a safe place and no one person or government or collection of governments can make it a safe place, therefore each person themselves should be responsible for their own protection and be allowed to protect themselves how they think fits, and if they feel that, that way is to own and carry and firearm then that's perfectly fine.

Yes I know how things work in America, I'm American I just don't agree with it. Sure you have some people who are mature enough to handle firearms when they are 14 or 15 but personally I don't trust anyone under the age of 25 with a firearm.

But yet we still hire 18 year old's to serve in the military and carry guns and even be military police officers on bases here in the US, so apparently there are mature people. It's a psychological problem that's the issue

Because doing anything to prevent Americans from purchasing, owning, or carrying firearms would be an infringement of our second amendment right. The only time firearms are not allowed are on privately owned property if the owner of that property declares they don't wish for you to have a firearm (this includes residential property and commercial property) guns are also not allowed (in some states) on school property unless locked away. Also carrying a gun doesn't mean you're responsible for protecting others, but it gives you a chance to protect yourself if you fear your life is in danger. Gun control is dependent of each state and each state makes it's own gun laws based on it's peoples decisions, but federal government control over this topic shouldn't be allowed because it wouldn't take into effect the decision of each state and the majority of the people in those states who may not agree with a gun controlling laws passed by the federal government making that law effected everywhere throughout the country, therefore harming their rights to firearms. Now Ben, i know for a fact you're from Britain where firearms are very hard to come by and virtually unseen or allowed except out in the country, so of course you may agree with certain gun control regulations but here in the US we have a certain right to them and those rights allow us to carry and own our firearms. And for people in the US who may think guns are bad or unneeded, that's their belief and if they choose not to own a firearm that's their decision too, but don't infringe on mine or anyone elses rights to firearms.

Now with all this being said the real problem is mental health. People are being diagnosed with mental health disabilities and are being forgotten. Now, convicted felons are not allowed to be in possession, around, or own a firearm....and maybe this should be placed into effect for people who have been diagnosed with mental health problems until they have been cleared and been proven to be psychologically fit to be released from a program, and after that point can purchase or be allowed to reclaim their firearms. But no matter what happens there will be mistakes made in any system and people expect the world to be a safe place, but the fact of the matter is the world will never be a safe place and no one person or government or collection of governments can make it a safe place, therefore each person themselves should be responsible for their own protection and be allowed to protect themselves how they think fits, and if they feel that, that way is to own and carry and firearm then that's perfectly fine.

But yet we still hire 18 year old's to serve in the military and carry guns and even be military police officers on bases here in the US, so apparently there are mature people. It's a psychological problem that's the issue

There seems to be this thing with some people from America, where protecting the right to carry around a gun is more important than the need to make it harder for people who want to do harm legally having access weapons. If making the process to legally acquire a weapon slightly more difficult which contains an in-depth background check for a variety of criminal or mental issues, if that saves lives then I don't see why it shouldn't be done. 

Also, yes. I am from the United Kingdom, but that doesn't mean I don't understand you have a legal right to have access to weapons, however revoking access is not what I am saying. I am saying that if you want a weapon, it should be regulated more, you can have access but you have to meet a certain criteria, you have to have a background check, no serious criminal past, no known mental issues. I don't see why people can't live with something as simple as that, you still can use your second amendment rights to have access to weapons, and people who have not met the criteria and who have a potential of killing people are unable to legally get a weapon and have it on them.

Now regulating the guns wouldn't solve everything, obviously you can get guns illegally in America pretty easily because of how many guns America has "laying around" however this measure could potentially save lives and as a Human I think this little inconvenience is quite worth it if it has the possibility of stopping innocent defenseless people from dying. 

There seems to be this thing with some people from America, where protecting the right to carry around a gun is more important than the need to make it harder for people who want to do harm legally having access weapons. If making the process to legally acquire a weapon slightly more difficult which contains an in-depth background check for a variety of criminal or mental issues, if that saves lives then I don't see why it shouldn't be done. 

Also, yes. I am from the United Kingdom, but that doesn't mean I don't understand you have a legal right to have access to weapons, however revoking access is not what I am saying. I am saying that if you want a weapon, it should be regulated more, you can have access but you have to meet a certain criteria, you have to have a background check, no serious criminal past, no known mental issues. I don't see why people can't live with something as simple as that, you still can use your second amendment rights to have access to weapons, and people who have not met the criteria and who have a potential of killing people are unable to legally get a weapon and have it on them.

Now regulating the guns wouldn't solve everything, obviously you can get guns illegally in America pretty easily because of how many guns America has "laying around" however this measure could potentially save lives and as a Human I think this little inconvenience is quite worth it if it has the possibility of stopping innocent defenseless people from dying. 

We don't want federal government intervention....especially when that intervention could cause a snowball effect causing more and more gun rights to be oppressed. There's a reason the foundering fathers constructed a 2nd amendment right....to protect ones self and to protect themselves from their own government for becoming what they had recently separated from.

Like i said, it's more a fight on mental health then gun control. We need to stop the fight on gun control and work on the war of mental health, because everyone of those guys causing a mass shooting had some kind of mental health disability....and as far as all the other shootings that take place those are mostly isolated incidents where the shooter was targeting one person or a small group of people who may had bullied them or cause some other issue.

I'd gather that all of those who partook in a shooting such as the one in question had Mental health issues, probably most hadn't even been tested for Mental issues so nobody even knew until it happened. However, to stop this through helping people with Mental Health issues would require everyone in America to be tested for Mental Health issues every year or so, which is impossible. The only logical way to decrease the amount of school shootings is through the weapons used in them, which can be regulated at a simpler and more logical level.

If you don't agree, then there is no end to this debate, because you believe in your freedom and as such your rights. Although I believe the lives of others should be held over the right to have access to weapons, but hey. I guess that's just my opinion, it's not my country, I feel safe enough as I currently am.

I'd gather that all of those who partook in a shooting such as the one in question had Mental health issues, probably most hadn't even been tested for Mental issues so nobody even knew until it happened. However, to stop this through helping people with Mental Health issues would require everyone in America to be tested for Mental Health issues every year or so, which is impossible. The only logical way to decrease the amount of school shootings is through the weapons used in them, which can be regulated at a simpler and more logical level.

If you don't agree, then there is no end to this debate, because you believe in your freedom and as such your rights. Although I believe the lives of others should be held over the right to have access to weapons, but hey. I guess that's just my opinion, it's not my country, I feel safe enough as I currently am.

But that would then continue the cycle of infringing on the 2nd amendment. And yes, I personally do think the rights of the people are important and i understand that there is no guarantee of safety, and that i myself must also provide safety for myself. This is also why when i turn 21 in about 5 or so years i will carry a firearm on me to help insure my safety and the safety of others around me (im also hoping to be a trooper by then so i would pretty much be obligated to carry one on me at all times). I also feel that if i was killed in a shooting or something involving a gun i would only hope no one would use that as a way to advocate gun control.

To some, they might have to view guns are a necessary evil....I for one consider them to be a necessity.

But yet we still hire 18 year old's to serve in the military and carry guns and even be military police officers on bases here in the US, so apparently there are mature people. It's a psychological problem that's the issue

Yes, and as someone who works with people who are 18, 19, 20 years old in the military I can tell you most of them are just as immature as any other American teenager. There are lots of people from Basic and AIT I would never want to go down range with.

I just can't understand why, why in the love of whoever you think lives in the clouds can americans still refuse to have gun control laws when you see all those shootings happening so often that instead of going "Omg that's horrible", we go "Oh look, another one". That's just plain stupid, it's been proven by all other countries over the world that having gun control laws reduces the rate of those shootings and all. Look at Australia. Look at Europe. Do you hear every two weeks or so "A crazy dude shot kids at a school"? No, you don't. Because people can't get a gun so easily.

Now you'll tell me "Bla bla bla if they want to kill someone they'll find a gun no matter what or they'll use something else like a knife or something". Yes. Sure, they could find another gun. But it would already lower the chances because they would actually have to search for a gun, and just for that they would already have a ton of chances to get caught and thus preventing the shooting. Then yes, they could use another weapon like a knife or something, but do you really think, in your right mind, that the guy will be able to kill so many people in such a short time? No.

Guns are a permit giving access to immediate murder from range. And that's fucked up, and nothing else.

Edited October 4, 201510 yr by Hystery

Seems like America cares more about their amendments than their lives...

This video is all I have to say.

This video is all I have to say.

This guy is just being facetious as an only counter-argument to all what people said. And that's certainly not going to make his point worth listening. Meanwhile, 45 mass shootings since the beginning of the year is all I've to say on my end.

This guy is just being facetious as an only counter-argument to all what people said. And that's certainly not going to make his point worth listening. Meanwhile, 45 mass shootings since the beginning of the year is all I've to say on my end.

No, this video is basically saying that guns don't kill people. People blame the guns, not the people. A Little over 32,000 people died in 2013 from automobile related accidents. Should we restrict people from owning cars too? There are responsible car owners and the ones that drive recklessly. Should all car owners be reprimanded for the actions of one? No. Just because some lunatic uses his gun irresponsible does not mean I should be punished. As soon as the government tries to take away our guns is the day people should rebel. Here is another video by him relating to gun control.