Tomorrow at midnight, the Patriot ACT, signed shortly after 9/11 will expire, which makes most of the powers given to law enforcement and the government defined in the bill null and void. Personally, I think this is a step in the right direction because the Patriot ACT was unconstitutional in the first place.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/30/politics/what-happens-if-the-patriot-act-provisions-expire/

Edited June 1, 201510 yr by TheAntiCapitalist

Tell me why it's better not to have it then to have it.

It was created to protect the U.S from terrorists acts, and to help LEA (Law Enforcement Agencies) preventing and obstructing acts of terrorism.

 

Without that Act, small Sheriffs Depts. can't do shit against ISIS, Al Quadea, Boko Haram or whatever those motherfuckers called.

Jesus Christ, LEA need to have power so something can be done, they can't sit and don't do shit.

Small sheriffs' departments aren't supposed to deal with international terrorist organizations (which does not include Boko Haram, which is a Nigerian rebel organization that does not commit acts of terror in other countries because that has nothing to do with their goal). That's the FBI's job. Nor were they ever capable of doing anything against terrorist organizations. Nor do they even have officers assigned to deal with international terrorists, because small sheriffs' offices have in the single or double digit numbers of deputies, and their deputies are assigned to deal with the actual crimes that happen in those counties (which notably do *not* include attacks by international terrorists as a rule, since places like Poweshiek County, Iowa have nothing of interest to international terrorist groups, being small, rural, and with nothing interesting or generally newsworthy in them).

The USA PATRIOT act, like every law passed right after a major abnormal event, is poorly thought-out. It is an insane overreaction to incredibly rare situations. The fact that it was passed to prevent acts of terror doesn't mean it's a good law, or that it does its job, or that it balances security with reasonable limits on government power. For instance, it allows issuing warrants where the person with the warrant served doesn't even know they had a warrant served against them, and allows secret courts to issue secret orders to wiretap a US citizen without meaningful chance for review. It allows the FBI (not even the secret court) to demand records about you and keep the person they demanded records from from telling anyone except their lawyer. It allows US foreign intelligence agencies to investigate regular domestic criminal cases. Many of these things have been used in normal criminal cases (like drug cases), for which there's not even "but terrorism!" aspect to it.

Tell me why it's better not to have it then to have it.

It was created to protect the U.S from terrorists acts, and to help LEA (Law Enforcement Agencies) preventing and obstructing acts of terrorism.

 

Without that Act, small Sheriffs Depts. can't do shit against ISIS, Al Quadea, Boko Haram or whatever those motherfuckers called.

Jesus Christ, LEA need to have power so something can be done, they can't sit and don't do shit.

I agree. I think this is a step to fucking retardation. I honestly wish that for just ONE day, all police would disappear and not be available. Then people will see how important police are to the success of our society, because I don't think people GET that. The areas of Baltimore that went through the rioting are seeing a lack of police; and last I checked, there were 35+ homicides last month in Baltimore. It's highest homicide rate since early 2000. You know why this rate went up? Because the police weren't sitting on their usual block, drinking a cup of coffee. They weren't driving their usual circle around the ghetto. They weren't doing a foot patrol down an abandoned block. Dumb as shit dude. 

I agree. I think this is a step to fucking retardation. I honestly wish that for just ONE day, all police would disappear and not be available. Then people will see how important police are to the success of our society, because I don't think people GET that. The areas of Baltimore that went through the rioting are seeing a lack of police; and last I checked, there were 35+ homicides last month in Baltimore. It's highest homicide rate since early 2000. You know why this rate went up? Because the police weren't sitting on their usual block, drinking a cup of coffee. They weren't driving their usual circle around the ghetto. They weren't doing a foot patrol down an abandoned block. Dumb as shit dude. 

​What does this have to do with the PATRIOT act? This just sounds like a rant to me.
 

Tell me why it's better not to have it then to have it.

It was created to protect the U.S from terrorists acts, and to help LEA (Law Enforcement Agencies) preventing and obstructing acts of terrorism.

 

Without that Act, small Sheriffs Depts. can't do shit against ISIS, Al Quadea, Boko Haram or whatever those motherfuckers called.

Jesus Christ, LEA need to have power so something can be done, they can't sit and don't do shit.

The PATRIOT act is unconstitutional under the 4th and 9th amendment. It was Bush's way to say 'Hey actually guys, we are doing something about this terrorist attack' and to attempt to gain the support of the American populace - he and his advisors were so wrapped up in the turmoil caused that they failed to properly scrutinise the bill. 
​Internal Law Enforcement shouldn't have major roles to play in detection and prevention of terrorism - that is the job of border agencies such as the FBI and CIA. You say 'Without that Act, small Sheriffs Depts. can't do s**t against ISIS, Al Quadea, Boko Haram or whatever those motherf****rs called.' well why would they want or need to do anything against them? It isn't their job to act on a global scale, their job is to protect the residents of their small towns from criminals. Do you really think a terrorist organisation will attack a village of 500 people?

Do you really think a terrorist organisation will attack a village of 500 people?

Terrorists don't give a shit how large a population is. If they can murder people for the sake of strengthening their cause, then that's what they're going to do. A terrorist would attack a village of 50 people. 

 The areas of Baltimore that went through the rioting are seeing a lack of police; and last I checked, there were 35+ homicides last month in Baltimore. It's highest homicide rate since early 2000. You know why this rate went up? Because the police weren't sitting on their usual block, drinking a cup of coffee. They weren't driving their usual circle around the ghetto. They weren't doing a foot patrol down an abandoned block. Dumb as shit dude. 

​Last I checked B-more has a long history of being in top-10 of the US crime rates. The art of policing was destroyed in Baltimore many years ago by then-mayor from the Democrats (who now is a governor and runs for the POTUS), just like in many other cities (in US and worldwide).

I can't really express my feeling towards the Patriot Act. One the one hand I like then they make the police work easier. On the other, giving agencies like the CIA so much powers doesn't actually make them work better. Secret courts, secret warrants, out-of-courts wiretaps... 

​Last I checked B-more has a long history of being in top-10 of the US crime rates. The art of policing was destroyed in Baltimore many years ago by then-mayor from the Democrats (who now is a governor and runs for the POTUS), just like in many other cities (in US and worldwide).

I can't really express my feeling towards the Patriot Act. One the one hand I like then they make the police work easier. On the other, giving agencies like the CIA so much powers doesn't actually make them work better. Secret courts, secret warrants, out-of-courts wiretaps... 

Crime has actually gone up in Baltimore since the riots. Crime was already high, but it just recently increased due to the amount of hate police and receiving. Plus the incompetent mayor decided to give the rioters "room to destroy". I've lived in Baltimore for a while and  depending on your location, you can be jumped for having an iPhone. It's gotten really bad in Baltimore since the riots. 

 

Maas far as the patriot act goes, I actually change my opinion on the matter. Police shouldn't be dealing with international terrorist organizations unless it directly relates to their local safety and security. It's entirely unconstitutional and if it's unconstitutional, I disagree with it. 

I for one agree with this, the patriot act was in fact unconstitutional, this act violated the basic rights to privacy and was very unorganized and planned poorly, hopefully lawmakers can make a better law that can deal with terrorism more directly and more effectively. 

Tell me why it's better not to have it then to have it.

It was created to protect the U.S from terrorists acts, and to help LEA (Law Enforcement Agencies) preventing and obstructing acts of terrorism.

 

Without that Act, small Sheriffs Depts. can't do shit against ISIS, Al Quadea, Boko Haram or whatever those motherfuckers called.

Jesus Christ, LEA need to have power so something can be done, they can't sit and don't do shit.

​the us government created isis/al queda, using them as pawns in the middle east giving them an excuse to overthrow the countrie's government that they don't like and to install a central banking system...our loving government is the biggest sponsor of terror....not sure why some people are still not aware of this

​the us government created isis/al queda, using them as pawns in the middle east giving them an excuse to overthrow the countrie's government that they don't like and to install a central banking system...our loving government is the biggest sponsor of terror....not sure why some people are still not aware of this

​HAHAHAHAHA. 

 

No offence but what the actual fuck are you on?

9/11, ISIS. Al Queada and all the other terrorist shit is terrorist shit. 

 

It's not the U.S government. Get facts. Do you have any proof that Bush did 9/11? Or that Obama created ISIS?

Edited June 1, 201510 yr by KarlieKloss

​HAHAHAHAHA. 

 

No offence but what the actual fuck are you on?

9/11, ISIS. Al Queada and all the other terrorist shit is terrorist shit. 

 

It's not the U.S government. Get facts. Do you have any proof that Bush did 9/11? Or that Obama created ISIS?

​oh please...its common knowledge by now, back in the 80s Rumsfeld shook hands with saddam and we supplied him with weapons including chemical when they were in a war with iran, the united states government has been in atleast 200 wars you should try to take a hint...you cant possible think that our government doesn't do acts of terrorism...900 bases in 153 countries bombing innocent kids,men,women its no wonder why we are referred to as the great satan

 

heres just ONE example of our government admitting to there creation of al queda https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=md-Ssme8RPc

heres Rumsfeld shaking hands with the enemy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r42oejmpkgw 

im sorry that im not brainwashed by the high tech propaganda but you do have an internet so I suggest that you go back in history and look up other how other countries turned tyrannical that used false flag terror operations, Nazi Germany was one of them

 

​HAHAHAHAHA. 

 

No offence but what the actual f**k are you on?

9/11, ISIS. Al Queada and all the other terrorist s**t is terrorist s**t. 

 

It's not the U.S government. Get facts. Do you have any proof that Bush did 9/11? Or that Obama created ISIS?

​There's no need to be degrading and rude.

Though presidents don't directly start terrorist organisations, their involvement in the Middle East with the Gulf Wars, Iraq/Iran, Syria etc lead to massive power vacuums where corrupt governments were removed, and the US failed to institute a strong government. 

​Keep in mind Bush actually funded Al Qaeda with money, weapons and surplus to fight the Russian invasion.

​oh please...its common knowledge by now, back in the 80s Rumsfeld shook hands with saddam and we supplied him with weapons including chemical when they were in a war with iran, the united states government has been in atleast 200 wars you should try to take a hint...you cant possible think that our government doesn't do acts of terrorism...900 bases in 153 countries bombing innocent kids,men,women its no wonder why we are referred to as the great satan

 

heres just ONE example of our government admitting to there creation of al queda https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=md-Ssme8RPc

heres Rumsfeld shaking hands with the enemy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r42oejmpkgw 

im sorry that im not brainwashed by the high tech propaganda but you do have an internet so I suggest that you go back in history and look up other how other countries turned tyrannical that used false flag terror operations, Nazi Germany was one of them

 

I'm not going to argue anymore because of this load of steaming bull.

If you hate the country and think it's corrupt you can go move somewhere else and shut up. Easy as that.

 

@stripe, sorry, I just get pissed when I don't get substantial facts.

The Soviet invasion was in the 80s, when Al Qaeda wasn't a threat nor big, and I'm pretty sure all that money ran out quick, so what they've got now is blood money and donations.

 

I'm not going to argue anymore because of this load of steaming bull.

If you hate the country and think it's corrupt you can go move somewhere else and shut up. Easy as that.

 

@stripe, sorry, I just get pissed when I don't get substantial facts.

The Soviet invasion was in the 80s, when Al Qaeda wasn't a threat nor big, and I'm pretty sure all that money ran out quick, so what they've got now is blood money and donations.

 

​uh where did I say I hate this country? no where I believe...I love this country...doesn't mean that I should blindly support a corrupt government run by banking cartels and corporations...tell me...when has the government ever told the truth? you don't want to argue because you are gullible person that lives under a rock you refuse to go do research which its obvious you haven't, theres plenty of information available out there ranging from the internet to the library you just have to use that brain to find it oh and heres another thing to look up...operation northwoods if you have a hard time reading or comprehending facts then heres a little picture

​uh where did I say I hate this country? no where I believe...I love this country...doesn't mean that I should blindly support a corrupt government run by banking cartels and corporations...tell me...when has the government ever told the truth? you don't want to argue because you are gullible person that lives under a rock you refuse to go do research which its obvious you haven't, theres plenty of information available out there ranging from the internet to the library you just have to use that brain to find it oh and heres another thing to look up...operation northwoods if you have a hard time reading or comprehending facts then heres a little picture

I think you've got the right idea When it comes to the American government, but you're taking it to the extreme dude. 

im just stating cold hard facts and trying to explain why these things happen if more people talked about the source of this terror instead of the pawns we might actually have nice things

im just stating cold hard facts

​^{[citation needed]}

 

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Either way you slice it, I'm fine with letting the Patriot Act expire.

Small sheriffs' departments aren't supposed to deal with international terrorist organizations (which does not include Boko Haram, which is a Nigerian rebel organization that does not commit acts of terror in other countries because that has nothing to do with their goal). That's the FBI's job. Nor were they ever capable of doing anything against terrorist organizations. Nor do they even have officers assigned to deal with international terrorists, because small sheriffs' offices have in the single or double digit numbers of deputies, and their deputies are assigned to deal with the actual crimes that happen in those counties (which notably do *not* include attacks by international terrorists as a rule, since places like Poweshiek County, Iowa have nothing of interest to international terrorist groups, being small, rural, and with nothing interesting or generally newsworthy in them).

The USA PATRIOT act, like every law passed right after a major abnormal event, is poorly thought-out. It is an insane overreaction to incredibly rare situations. The fact that it was passed to prevent acts of terror doesn't mean it's a good law, or that it does its job, or that it balances security with reasonable limits on government power. For instance, it allows issuing warrants where the person with the warrant served doesn't even know they had a warrant served against them, and allows secret courts to issue secret orders to wiretap a US citizen without meaningful chance for review. It allows the FBI (not even the secret court) to demand records about you and keep the person they demanded records from from telling anyone except their lawyer. It allows US foreign intelligence agencies to investigate regular domestic criminal cases. Many of these things have been used in normal criminal cases (like drug cases), for which there's not even "but terrorism!" aspect to it.

​

​Actually Boko Haram has been quite active in other countries recently, and also just pledged allegiance to ISIS.

Although you are right. This is law was poorly written, but was really only meant for Federal level LEAs and intelligence services. 

 

I think you've got the right idea When it comes to the American government, but you're taking it to the extreme dude. 

​That is almost correct, unfortunately. If you're still going into the military I would encourage you to remember what that oath means from the moment you take it, to whenever you're discharged. You are defending the Constitution from all enemies, foreign AND domestic- wisest thing I ever heard from that nutcase, Jesse Ventura.

 

 

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But you guys think this actually matters? The government did it before the Patriot Act was signed, and will continue doing it. Just because a little piece of paper says they can't anymore doesn't mean shit to them. The Constitution used to mean something. It now is only quoted, cited, or used in defense of a person/party that would benefit from it.

Edited June 2, 201510 yr by Pavelow

​

​Actually Boko Haram has been quite active in other countries recently, and also just pledged allegiance to ISIS.

Although you are right. This is law was poorly written, but was really only meant for Federal level LEAs and intelligence services. 

 

​That is almost correct, unfortunately. If you're still going into the military I would encourage you to remember what that oath means from the moment you take it, to whenever you're discharged. You are defending the Constitution from all enemies, foreign AND domestic- wisest thing I ever heard from that nutcase, Jesse Ventura.

 

 

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But you guys think this actually matters? The government did it before the Patriot Act was signed, and will continue doing it. Just because a little piece of paper says they can't anymore doesn't mean shit to them. The Constitution used to mean something. It now is only quoted, cited, or used in defense of a person/party that would benefit from it.

Which is exactly why I mentioned before that my opinion on this has completely changed. I did a bit of research and found that the act is entirely unconstitutional. Originally I was supporting the government over the constitution, which is retarded. If it's unconstitutional then I want it gone immediately; but as you said, it probably wouldn't matter either way.