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Technically the bill has only passed in the Senate and not the House yet, so I'm cautiously optimistic. However, analysts expect it to pass in the House as well.

It only funds the government for a few months so there is a potential for the whole thing to continue again later.

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Technically the bill has only passed in the Senate and not the House yet, so I'm cautiously optimistic. However, analysts expect it to pass in the House as well.

It only funds the government for a few months so there is a potential for the whole thing to continue again later.

if it happens again its going to be worse

This country is going downhill, that's what I think. Eventually it will come to an end, just like every other civilization.

America is a strong country yes the country is going downhill but it will not end for sure

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if it happens again its going to be worse

America is a strong country yes the country is going downhill but it will not end for sure

Every superpower fails, especially when they become a global police force. It doesn't matter what personal feelings are held by its occupants, a country $17 trillion in debt (and constantly increasing) won't last long.


Sticks and stones may break bones, but 5.56 fragments on impact.

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Every superpower fails, especially when they become a global police force. It doesn't matter what personal feelings are held by its occupants, a country $17 trillion in debt (and constantly increasing) won't last long.

you just wait America will last forever

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Yeah, no. It's really REALLY REALLY that the US collapses soon, but it will not last forever. I don't mean "well, humans will go extinct eventually": so far, there have been untold numbers of civilizations, many of which lasted WAY longer than the US has so far, that collapsed.

That said, @c13: In the whole history of the US, how long do you think we *weren't* in debt? The answer is "under a year, between 1835 and 1836". Other than that year, the US has been in debt. Around a third of the $17 billion is money the US government owes to itself. Of the rest, about half is owed to entities within the US. The US doesn't have that much foreign debt, especially compared with GDP. The numbers are big, but the US GDP is twice that of any other country in the world (unless you consider the EU to be a country, which I don't, at least not yet).

Back to topic: I know a lot of people whose parents will be very happy because of this.

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Every superpower fails, especially when they become a global police force. It doesn't matter what personal feelings are held by its occupants, a country $17 trillion in debt (and constantly increasing) won't last long.

 

You said it!

 

you just wait America will last forever

 

What you seem to not understand is history. If you have ever studied it and I'm not trying to be mean but you will find that eventually every civilization will fall. It's just a matter of time before that happens to America. 


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That said, @c13: In the whole history of the US, how long do you think we *weren't* in debt? The answer is "under a year, between 1835 and 1836". Other than that year, the US has been in debt. Around a third of the $17 billion is money the US government owes to itself. Of the rest, about half is owed to entities within the US. The US doesn't have that much foreign debt, especially compared with GDP. The numbers are big, but the US GDP is twice that of any other country in the world (unless you consider the EU to be a country, which I don't, at least not yet).

Back to topic: I know a lot of people whose parents will be very happy because of this.

My point wasn't that it will be immediate, but with current spending habits by both parties causing debt to massively increase in the last 40 years coupled with partisanship, it is really far fetched to say nothing will ever happen as a direct result of the debt.


Sticks and stones may break bones, but 5.56 fragments on impact.

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I'm not going to engage in a discussion in which I have no knowledge of the subject, but I think this entire thing is getting beyond ridiculous. I care little for politicians who do not care for the population of the country. This has gone on far enough.


"Don't quote me on that" - ineseri

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I think the US federal government will collapse a few months after they eventually inevitably default on their debt obligations. The US is several trillions of dollars in debt and it exceeds what they'll ever be able to repay.

 

What is most likely to happen is the US will probably split up, states will declare themselves independent. It's not that far fetched, and most people have predicted that to happen in the near future.

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One can only wonder what may happen as result of this... and what the effects beyond the country may be.

 

Hope it doesn't escalate. Then again, this had to be expected. That's the way the (monetary) system apparently works, and there has to be a "restart" or "reset". At least that's what also people on the markets / exchange experts say. With increasing nation debt there has to be a "cut", or reset eventually.

 

However that may look like. Then again don't throw stones into my direction. I am no expert on the matter, nor qualified in any serious way. Just seems logical though.

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I think the US federal government will collapse a few months after they eventually inevitably default on their debt obligations. The US is several trillions of dollars in debt and it exceeds what they'll ever be able to repay.

 

What is most likely to happen is the US will probably split up, states will declare themselves independent. It's not that far fetched, and most people have predicted that to happen in the near future.

Er, yes, people have predicted that, but they aren't necessarily the sorts of people you should look to for actual analysis. The people who say things like "the US will break into states" generally have somewhat tenuous grasps on reality. This IS that far-fetched; people in the US overwhelmingly think of themselves as Americans, not as residents of their states (Texans are an exception, not the rule). This isn't like Scotland in the UK.

As for the US defaulting on debt, the US debt-to-GDP ratio is lower than a LOT of other countries (including, by the way, the UK). As of now, the US can issue debt at very low interest rates. When debt comes due, they can issue more debt to make up for it. In the small scale, the US does repay all its debt; they just do it by issuing more. However, because the debt is repaid to individual creditors, there isn't serious risk in loaning the US money. The greatest risk of default is if Congress refuses to issue more debt, not that there will be a shortage of buyers.

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Er, yes, people have predicted that, but they aren't necessarily the sorts of people you should look to for actual analysis. The people who say things like "the US will break into states" generally have somewhat tenuous grasps on reality.

As for the US defaulting on debt, the US debt-to-GDP ratio is lower than a LOT of other countries (including, by the way, the UK). As of now, the US can issue debt at very low interest rates. When debt comes due, they can issue more debt to make up for it. In the small scale, the US does repay all its debt; they just do it by issuing more. However, because the debt is repaid to individual creditors, there isn't serious risk in loaning the US money. The greatest risk of default is if Congress refuses to issue more debt, not that there will be a shortage of buyers.

I think people can make their own judgements and see the whole western world is not in a good shape. I think you'd have to be oblivious to believe we can continue the current cycle. Especially when you think the US federal reserve bank (which isn't actually federal) can control the dollar and keep it propped up with any real value when they're so incompetent they "lose" 9 trillion dollars.

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Every superpower fails, especially when they become a global police force. It doesn't matter what personal feelings are held by its occupants, a country $17 trillion in debt (and constantly increasing) won't last long.

 

A country $17 million in debt, yes. Also a Triple A credit rating. Talks are it will go down to Double A+. I think many citizens are confused about a country debt. This isnt paying your mortage off people. Yes $17 trillion is a lot, there is no doubt. Like someone posted before, a lot of it is owed to ourself. Foreign debt is quite low considereing our escapades in other countries. Obviously nothing with last forever, not even humans. Expecting the government to fail, or states to break up, or whatever nonsense even close to < 75 years in the future is delusioned. We are in debt, but we are a superpower, in military, political, and economic terms. As i stated earlier, a nation's debt is much, much, much more complex than even a Single state's debt, it will take a lot more to bring us down. Second, i dont follow you on a global police force, Yes, we definately get into other's business, No it isnt good. However, no real superpower before us has ever "fallen" due to such occasions, Rome, Germany, etc. do not count, as they were strictly militaristic in most aspects. (atleast Rome). What I'm saying is... you basically stating that all superpowers fail, when they become a global police force, (which i agree we are, and not a good thing) but, name a country, that has been dubbed a "superpower" that has "failed." There really isn't one, so essentially we're still treading on forbidden ground.  Likewise with everything said, Politicans need to get their shit together, and America is definately not in its best state, but hey, peopel in the 30s were saying the same thing. We'll get through it.

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"The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge natural to party dissention, which in different ages & countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism. But this leads at length to a more formal and permanent despotism. The disorders & miseries, which result, gradually incline the minds of men to seek security & repose in the absolute power of an Individual: and sooner or later the chief of some prevailing faction more able or more fortunate than his competitors, turns this disposition to the purposes of his own elevation, on the ruins of Public Liberty." 

— George Washington, September 19, 1796

 

'Nuff said. 

 

It seems both parties observe what they hold true to their parties and not the country as a whole.

Which is frustrating when those who are supposed to represent the US, are to busy representing their own party rather than working to unite the two parties.

 

A good friend of mine said on day one of the shutdown

"Take away their paychecks, they will work a hell of a lot faster, and better".

Could not agree more.

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The only real reason the government pass the bill, is because the country would be in default on its debit. The only true reason.

Obama don't care about nothing else, but his stupid health care plan, which is going to hurt more people than help them. Employers are not hiring, in certain states if 32 hours is considered "full-time", you will be capped at 31 hours.

Its just a bunch BS. Ever since 2001, our country (USA) has slowly folded.

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-snip-

 

"Take away their paychecks, they will work a hell of a lot faster, and better".

Could not agree more.

 and take away there travel expenses, heath care, and any else the government help pays for them  


 

if your replying to me Please @0taku or Quote me so I get a notification 

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"The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge natural to party dissention, which in different ages & countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism. But this leads at length to a more formal and permanent despotism. The disorders & miseries, which result, gradually incline the minds of men to seek security & repose in the absolute power of an Individual: and sooner or later the chief of some prevailing faction more able or more fortunate than his competitors, turns this disposition to the purposes of his own elevation, on the ruins of Public Liberty." 

— George Washington, September 19, 1796

 

'Nuff said. 

 

It seems both parties observe what they hold true to their parties and not the country as a whole.

Which is frustrating when those who are supposed to represent the US, are to busy representing their own party rather than working to unite the two parties.

 

A good friend of mine said on day one of the shutdown

"Take away their paychecks, they will work a hell of a lot faster, and better".

Could not agree more.

Except Congress still got paid. The shutdown didn't affect any money that's subject to permanent appropriation; that's why Social Security was unaffected. It only affected money that has to be reappropriated every year. Congressional salary isn't in that category; while most appropriations say "pay Y money out of the Treasury for fiscal year XXXX", members of Congress are paid under law that just says "pay Y money out of the Treasury". Even if Congress wanted to eliminate its own pay during the shutdown, it's probably unconstitutional to do so: The 27th Amendment, proposed with the Bill of Rights (yeah, it took ~200 years to ratify), says that any adjustments to congressional pay take effect starting in the next term; Congress can't change its pay for the current term (this is to discourage Congress from voting to give themselves ALL TEH MONEYZ; if they did so, they could be voted out before they had a chance to collect).

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What would happen if a country were to go bankrupt?

Would it dissolve into the neighboring countries?

 

Not implying anything, by the way...

WORLD DOMINATION!

 

Even if the country did go bankrupt, it still has a huge military force, so I don't think Mexico is going to take over the US if it goes bankrupt. The only catch is that the government wouldn't really have a lot of money to pay for the army, but I think soldiers could take other forms of payment. For example, they could be paid with the US oil reserves or land.

 

That's not going to happen anyway, so it doesn't matter. :P I wonder if the government has actually done research on ways to pay it's military without using US dollars.

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If the US defaults, other countries would be much, much less likely to loan to it in the future. This would force the US government to resort to printing more money (causing inflation; that's one way massive inflation and worthless currency happens) or, y'know, spend within the money collected from taxes (yeah, right). I'm not sure if creditors could technically repossess US government property, but good luck trying (as a general rule, don't piss off nuclear powers).

Even if the US defaulted, it could still issue currency. The value of the currency would go down, but they could still print money to pay soldiers. Remember, the US literally has a license to print money. Or, if the whim should strike (it often does), the US may legally just declare itself to have more money. The Fed can loan to banks by just saying "You have X dollars now".

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If the US defaults, other countries would be much, much less likely to loan to it in the future. This would force the US government to resort to printing more money (causing inflation; that's one way massive inflation and worthless currency happens) or, y'know, spend within the money collected from taxes (yeah, right). I'm not sure if creditors could technically repossess US government property, but good luck trying (as a general rule, don't piss off nuclear powers).

Even if the US defaulted, it could still issue currency. The value of the currency would go down, but they could still print money to pay soldiers. Remember, the US literally has a license to print money. Or, if the whim should strike (it often does), the US may legally just declare itself to have more money. The Fed can loan to banks by just saying "You have X dollars now".

 

Yeah, the only thing I would worry about is that the currency would collapse too, and the soldiers would refuse to accept dollars.

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