Hey guys im about to join an explorer program in oregon and its an actual emergency response team that has a academy. So my big question is do you think kids 16+ with a valid driver's license should be allowed to install red and white emergency lights and a siren to there personal car??

 

My opinion is: When you call 911 and say your lost,stuck out in the woods,hiking trip ended bad,stuck out in the water...ETC These all count as Code 3 emergency calls why call us in if we have to drive like normal people through heavy traffic to the station and wait for our team leader and other members? I mean so what there 16 Normal officers have to work there butts off to drive a patrol car why cant we do the same i dont mind doing code 3 driving training a few dozen times. Code 3 means life or death and if its so that we cant have any emergency lights or siren........Do not guarantee on us to rescue you on time so i want to hear your beliefs take into account on GTA lcpdfr when you get a shootout call do you drive normally to the station and slowy make your way to your assault rifle then rush to the call? SAR is a team the kids take the academy our deputies do some training but the kids kinda teach them they cant do it by there selfs if they could why would they ask for volunteers?? Thank you

No. Because emergency responses with lights and sirens mean that there is either serious risk of immediate injury or some one already seriously injured, and quite frankly, I don't trust people who had just got their driver's license to drive fast.

Well if you were in a plane crash how long would you wanna wait for help 15 min or 45 min ;) think about that one

They just dont give cops guns and cars we have to have training and have to be responsible they dont give every person a everything they want if i had to work my ass off for those i will and im not plannning on making a mistake if you have to dial 911 It is an emergency and thats what you do.

Well if you were in a plane crash how long would you wanna wait for help 15 min or 45 min ;) think about that one

They just dont give cops guns and cars we have to have training and have to be responsible they dont give every person a everything they want if i had to work my ass off for those i will and im not plannning on making a mistake if you have to dial 911 It is an emergency and thats what you do.

I agree, I think this is a good idea. Most explorer academies last 5 days, so why not add in a couple EVOC days? Plus, vol. firefighters can have lights+sirens

Well if you were in a plane crash how long would you wanna wait for help 15 min or 45 min ;) think about that one

The odds of that are extremely slim, and SAR parties are when a location isn't for sure.

 

While time is of the essence, SAR operations generally happen with no clue where some one specifically is. A detailed plan with grid references will do more than ambling through the woods, and that planning takes more time than a response. Given that the minors wouldn't be essential to the planning, they aren't required to be the first ones in the area, diminishing the usefulness of giving them emergency equipment that encourages them to drive fast.

 

And honestly, what person/politician/agency in their right mind would think giving people who just got their driver's licenses an excuse to drive fast is a good idea?

They just dont give cops guns and cars we have to have training and have to be responsible they dont give every person a everything they want if i had to work my ass off for those i will and im not plannning on making a mistake if you have to dial 911 It is an emergency and thats what you do.

Driving has a massive amount to do with experience. My state requires 50 hours on the road before getting a license. While a 16 year old may have 55 hours on the road with an EVOC course, that's absolutely nothing compared to the cops who have had 10 years working a job where they spend 75%+ of their time on the road in a patrol car. Even the applicants who are only 21 years old tend to have hundreds of more hours driving than some one who just got a license.

 

Again, giving new drivers the excuse to drive fast just isn't a good idea, and for the purpose it would be used for, is not essential, and would probably create much more of a public safety risk due to inexperience.

No. Because emergency responses with lights and sirens mean that there is either serious risk of immediate injury or some one already seriously injured, and quite frankly, I don't trust people who had just got their driver's license to drive fast.

This.

 

Also, when was the last plane crash where a 16 year old who had "training" could have done something? And also, if the response time for a plane crash (or any incident) is 45 minutes, I suggest you get the f*** out of wherever you live. ASAP  

Everything you say is negative then why do we have a fire department why do we even have lights on our SAR Vehicles? Why should we even have a SAR team jeez It sounds like minors can't do anything an excuse to drive fast?? Who do you think we are you make it sound like were the type of people who are misbehaving what kid on earth would work there ass off in training to save people i mean id get pissed if i couldn't reunite a dad back to his children who miss him or a boy or girl to there mother who says that her kid is her life and to me c13 your making it sound like so what a person is gone its a human being were all alike and your saying that youth taking a long time to save one is not a big deal. Unpaid volunteers risking there lives working there ass's off to save these people. We have kids who live out farther than everyone else in the county how are they gonna help there could be our smartest guy on the team out there and he cant get to the call on time just because he cant use EMERGENCY Lights Or a siren to save that person? When my little cousin got lost i saw police and SAR teams all over the county go with lights and sirens to find him they found him in a ditch all dirty and his acl was torn and they said if they had taken a little bit longer he would of died i was so happy they found him they didnt drive slow they didnt take there time they had all there guys going all over the place asking questions doing search's in places and if it weren't for those lights and sirens to get through traffic and chop down the time it takes for them to get to those places he would of died and his parents would be in shock and great that ruined someones life they should be proud of them selfs

See visble sounds like everything you rely on is media press news you dont know what happens outside in this world most emergency responders dont want the media all up on there nuts on something they did or didnt do

Would you like to make a split second decision and then get judged on it for the next month and a half? The whole world can see

You look like a power-hungry kid to be honest. Lights and sirens on a vehicle are no "fun" matter, they are present for a reason. Besides, you know, every state has laws against lights and sirens abuse. 

 

I'm completely against.

Well if you were in a plane crash how long would you wanna wait for help 15 min or 45 min ;) think about that one

They just dont give cops guns and cars we have to have training and have to be responsible they dont give every person a everything they want if i had to work my ass off for those i will and im not plannning on making a mistake if you have to dial 911 It is an emergency and thats what you do.

 

If i was in a plane crash, I'm POSITIVE, they would not send "explorers" out. There would be police, probably federal, out there.

 

Everything you say is negative then why do we have a fire department why do we even have lights on our SAR Vehicles? Why should we even have a SAR team jeez It sounds like minors can't do anything an excuse to drive fast?? Who do you think we are you make it sound like were the type of people who are misbehaving what kid on earth would work there ass off in training to save people i mean id get pissed if i couldn't reunite a dad back to his children who miss him or a boy or girl to there mother who says that her kid is her life and to me c13 your making it sound like so what a person is gone its a human being were all alike and your saying that youth taking a long time to save one is not a big deal. Unpaid volunteers risking there lives working there ass's off to save these people. We have kids who live out farther than everyone else in the county how are they gonna help there could be our smartest guy on the team out there and he cant get to the call on time just because he cant use EMERGENCY Lights Or a siren to save that person? When my little cousin got lost i saw police and SAR teams all over the county go with lights and sirens to find him they found him in a ditch all dirty and his acl was torn and they said if they had taken a little bit longer he would of died i was so happy they found him they didnt drive slow they didnt take there time they had all there guys going all over the place asking questions doing search's in places and if it weren't for those lights and sirens to get through traffic and chop down the time it takes for them to get to those places he would of died and his parents would be in shock and great that ruined someones life they should be proud of them selfs

See visble sounds like everything you rely on is media press news you dont know what happens outside in this world most emergency responders dont want the media all up on there nuts on something they did or didnt do

Would you like to make a split second decision and then get judged on it for the next month and a half? The whole world can see

Your cousin was a small child. There are other factors at play, like less sense of direction, less survival skills, less chance of fighting off a wild animal and the big threat that would mobilize police more being abduction.

 

And it's not only the driving skill you think you have that matters. There are other people on the roads too. Chances are EXTREMELY high that you and others your age don't know what to look out for with other drivers. Being told and subconsciously knowing are separate things

 

If you can't even take the time to come up with a comparison that isn't a police mod in a violent video game, I am even less likely to support giving you the power to drive dangerously.

francis ive made my point not gonna argue anymore

guys 

Here are a few of the topics that are covered during routine training:   

 

• Land Navigation (including GPS)
• Man Tracking
• Search Techniques
• Rope Rescue Techniques
• Wilderness Survival
• First Aid and Wilderness Medicine
• Patient Care and Packaging
• Communications
• Helicopter Safety and Rescue
• Incident Command System (ICS)
• Traffic and Crowd Control
• Personal and Professional Ethics
• Self Defense
• Firearms Safety
• Patrol Tactics
• Officer Survival
• Traumatic Incident Stress
• Criminal Law

Shortly after the Post began, Sheriff Barnes saw a need for a ground search and rescue team in Washington County. The Explorers were a logical choice.  Since the Post began, the Explorers have participated in hundreds of search and rescue missions throughout Oregon and Washington. Now with both young men and women as part of its program, Explorer Post #877 is one of only a few Explorer programs in the country that fills the dual roles of Search and Rescue and Law Enforcement. This post has an outstanding reputation because of the high personal and professional standards met by all our members.  Their skills and services are often called upon by police agencies throughout Oregon.  In fact, our Explorers are the primary ground Search and Rescue team for Washington County.  Our members are actively involved in Search and Rescue missions for lost people, downed aircraft, and evidence in major crimes.

 

francis ive made my point not gonna argue anymore

guys 

Here are a few of the topics that are covered during routine training:   

 

• Land Navigation (including GPS)
• Man Tracking
• Search Techniques
• Rope Rescue Techniques
• Wilderness Survival
• First Aid and Wilderness Medicine
• Patient Care and Packaging
• Communications
• Helicopter Safety and Rescue
• Incident Command System (ICS)
• Traffic and Crowd Control
• Personal and Professional Ethics
• Self Defense
• Firearms Safety
• Patrol Tactics
• Officer Survival
• Traumatic Incident Stress
• Criminal Law

Shortly after the Post began, Sheriff Barnes saw a need for a ground search and rescue team in Washington County. The Explorers were a logical choice.  Since the Post began, the Explorers have participated in hundreds of search and rescue missions throughout Oregon and Washington. Now with both young men and women as part of its program, Explorer Post #877 is one of only a few Explorer programs in the country that fills the dual roles of Search and Rescue and Law Enforcement. This post has an outstanding reputation because of the high personal and professional standards met by all our members.  Their skills and services are often called upon by police agencies throughout Oregon.  In fact, our Explorers are the primary ground Search and Rescue team for Washington County.  Our members are actively involved in Search and Rescue missions for lost people, downed aircraft, and evidence in major crimes.

 

 

I'll use your own words against you. You said since the Explorers began they've been in hundreds of rescue missions..... They did it without lights, you can too. You're 15 or 16 years old, you are not mature enough to handle the responsibility of having red lights on top of your car. For gods sake you havent even had your license that long. (all state laws are different, but i doubt you can get a license before your 14 or 15), a five day academy is simply not enough training. I went through a 4 month academy, before i was trusted to operate a class A emergency vehicle. The fact that you are so eager to have the responsiblity is proof enough you are not mature.  I don't mean it to sound harsh, I've wanted to be a police officer since I was young, but you have to learn to walk before you run. Participate in your program and do well, don't rush things. Also, don't come to a forumn that has experienced Law enforcement officers and try to argue your point against theres. Trust us, we've been there.

 

I'm also from Oregon and it is my understanding that POVs can't drive faster than the posted speed limit anyway.  I'm pretty sure you are still not considered an emergency vehicle even if you have lights and/or a siren so you don't get to disobey ordinances and laws that apply to normal vehicles.  In addition to that if you get into an accident driving like a hooligan when you expect people to get out of the way you are not covered as an emergency vehicle so its out of pocket.  

 

On another note, I am personally 17 at the time of this post and I think if you are a trained, certified, first responder in our age range having warning equipment is not out of the question.  However, volunteer Search and Rescue doesn't seem to be a Code 3 call for non-paid emergency personnel.  Just my opinion.  From what I've seen around here, Jackson County, it looked to me that even the marked SAR vehicles owned by the Sheriff's office only have amber lighting anyway.  

 

I'm going into fire science and the paramedic program at my local community college next year and will hopefully get my FF1 soon so I can become a volunteer for a department around here.  Once I have the proper training and skills to fight fire, respond to MVAs and treat minor to moderate injuries I'm going to look into lighting on my vehicle for the purpose of responding to the station or directly to the incident depending on location.  However, being Oregonians, the lighting equipment can't be owned by us either, the department has to own it.  Given the budgetary restrictions in place currently all over the state and in turn the country I doubt much will come of it.

 

Again, personally I think the application you're describing (if I understood your post right) doesn't call for code 3 response from explorers.  Let us know how it plays out, I'm interested.

 

As someone who has had their license for a bit and I am about at your stage of age etc, I can relate to you. 

However, I would say absolutely 100% no to letting anyone our age have lights and sirens. Not matter your experience or maturity, there are so many things that go into driving and thats just following the laws.

Add in running red lights, weaving through traffic and all other things emergency responders have to do, very few new drivers would be able to handle it. 

 

Additionally, if you are someone like myself, I often hang with friends and will sometimes let them borrow my car/drive and having equipment like that which is basically a speeding free card is recipe for disaster. 

 

There's a reason that most emergency responders are at least 18+. And those that are under 18 have limits. Not to mention could you imagine the legal issues if a newly licensed kid running code 3 got in an accident and death/serious injuries occurred? Major law suits and California Driving laws would possibly revoke my license until I was 18. 

Everything you say is negative then why do we have a fire department why do we even have lights on our SAR Vehicles? Why should we even have a SAR team jeez It sounds like minors can't do anything an excuse to drive fast?? Who do you think we are you make it sound like were the type of people who are misbehaving what kid on earth would work there ass off in training to save people i mean id get pissed if i couldn't reunite a dad back to his children who miss him or a boy or girl to there mother who says that her kid is her life and to me c13 your making it sound like so what a person is gone its a human being were all alike and your saying that youth taking a long time to save one is not a big deal. Unpaid volunteers risking there lives working there ass's off to save these people. We have kids who live out farther than everyone else in the county how are they gonna help there could be our smartest guy on the team out there and he cant get to the call on time just because he cant use EMERGENCY Lights Or a siren to save that person? When my little cousin got lost i saw police and SAR teams all over the county go with lights and sirens to find him they found him in a ditch all dirty and his acl was torn and they said if they had taken a little bit longer he would of died i was so happy they found him they didnt drive slow they didnt take there time they had all there guys going all over the place asking questions doing search's in places and if it weren't for those lights and sirens to get through traffic and chop down the time it takes for them to get to those places he would of died and his parents would be in shock and great that ruined someones life they should be proud of them selfs

See visble sounds like everything you rely on is media press news you dont know what happens outside in this world most emergency responders dont want the media all up on there nuts on something they did or didnt do

Would you like to make a split second decision and then get judged on it for the next month and a half? The whole world can see

C13 is simply posting his opinion on your topic, you seem to be taking it as a direct insult and you're trying to make him out to be a "kid hater" when the only thing he's doing is stating what he thinks is the appropriate response.

You're a kid, you don't know shit from shinola yet.  Bottom line, you have zero life experience, let alone driving experience.  So hell no!  

 

Once you're able to shave, you're balls drop, the pimples and acne go away and you get laid a few times, come back and ask then.

 

EDIT:  "The only source of knowledge is experience" - Albert Einstein

 

DrDetroit

Edited February 14, 201412 yr by drdetroit

detroit if your trying to make your self as "mature" your very iggnorant and use vulgar language

Atleast he can spell and form simple sentences.

As an Emergency Medical Technician's Point of View (Age 17 currently) If you feel you are a comfortable and DEFENSIVE driver, and understand the LIGHTS and SIRENS only REQUEST the right of way ! I am all for it, I know Middle Age adults who are really afraid of using Lights and sirens. Me personally yes I am a teenager, but when it comes down to EMS and a PATIENT I am 100 percent serious. Its YOUR safety FIRST ! Being 1 min early to a call wont make a difference if you as an Emergency Service provider arrives there DEAD because YOU didn't receive the right of way at the last intersection prior to the scene !

You're a kid, you don't know shit from shinola yet.  Bottom line, you have zero life experience, let alone driving experience.  So hell no!  

 

Once you're able to shave, you're balls drop, the pimples and acne go away and you get laid a few times, come back and ask then.

 

EDIT:  "The only source of knowledge is experience" - Albert Einstein

 

DrDetroit

What the hell is your problem?  Stop being such an asshole.  Seems like us 16, 17, 18 year olds on here are acting more mature than you seeing as we can have a civil conversation and debate without coming off like ignorant douche bags.  I apologize to the mods in advance, I know flame wars are not tolerated but I couldn't help myself, this guy is a total ass.  Not gonna post in this section again, have fun arguing over something that really shouldn't have gotten this heated in the first place.