I'm not one to judge police officers when they shoot someone, I know that the story media reports is often inaccurate. But this seems strange. A woman calls 911 to report some kind of assault, goes up to the window, and gets shot through it? It just seems strange why a white, middle aged woman living in an affluent, middle class suburb would be shot dead. Anyone have any ideas or opinions on it?

Apparently it's now being considered a homicide.

 

Which i agree with, since the situation was for a sexual assault.. not exactly a firearm needed call. And the fact both officers didn't have their body cameras on is suspicious.. one officer with it off is coincidence, but both? pretty suspicious 

Quote

Damond, in her pajamas, went to the driver’s side door and was talking to the driver. The officer in the passenger seat pulled his gun and shot Damond through the driver’s side door, sources said. No weapon was found at the scene.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/midwest/ct-minneapolis-police-shooting-justine-damond-20170717-story.html

 

My guess? A gross case of firearm safety rules violation. If that's what it is, such incidents do not help the law enforcement to build trust with people. At all.

 

However, we don't know the full story... However I'm struggling to think of anything else.

 

Edited July 18, 20178 yr by Hastings

From what I heard the woman was talking to the officer driving the car, when the officer's partner leaned over and shot her past him. Seems very strange indeed.

I agree with it being called a homicide. Its not the usual case of just some gangbanger living in a sh*t area.  maybe the officer somehow knew her or had something to do with her? why he would just murder her is unknown.

Homicide is when one human kills another regardless if it's a PD shooting or not it will always be considered a homicide initially if it was in self defense or not.

Now they are saying that his partner heard a loud noise. The police radio channel mentioned fireworks. Might seem legit if it weren't for the circumstances of not turning a body cam on. The car camera would have come on if the lights were turned on. They did not have theirs on. Very sketchy. They should make it a requirement to write a statement. Its ridiculous. Here in the UK I'm pretty sure you have to write a statement when you Taser someone (may be wrong, and it is a little bit OTT here in the UK). At least now they can't say US police are racist. 

I understand that body cams being on the entire time will make them run out of memory faster, but cops should not be able to turn them off.  They should only be able turn on/off audio.  It makes me laugh when some cops throw a fit about having to wear a body cam, because then you wonder....what do they have to hide?  More often than not, body cam can save an officer's life and/or his career.

1 hour ago, Kallus Rourke said:

I understand that body cams being on the entire time will make them run out of memory faster, but cops should not be able to turn them off.  They should only be able turn on/off audio.  It makes me laugh when some cops throw a fit about having to wear a body cam, because then you wonder....what do they have to hide?  More often than not, body cam can save an officer's life and/or his career.

The only thing I can think of is that I feel (and this is all true, firearms officers in the UK talk about it) is that it can be very misleading watching a video on YouTube and thinking "why the hell did he shoot them" when if you look at it from how the cop actually saw it it may be different. Tunnel vision and all that. And also privacy issues, but not such an issue with an actual bodycam. As you said, they need to be made to turn on automatically. This shooting is clearly unjustified, and its the only one I've felt strongly against. 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/07/19/us/minneapolis-australian-woman-killed-by-police/index.html

 

If you are startled that easily and the first thing you do is fire your weapon - across your partners face no less - you have no right to be a police officer.

On 7/18/2017 at 4:08 PM, SCRTAGNT69 said:

Homicide is when one human kills another regardless if it's a PD shooting or not it will always be considered a homicide initially if it was in self defense or not.

Not exactly true. 

 

By definition, a homicide is the deliberate and unlawful killing of one person by another. It's a synonym for murder. Self-defense can be considered homicide, but it would depend on the circumstances surrounding each individual case.

Edited July 19, 20178 yr by TheDivineHustle

Most Body Worn Cameras (BWC) have a 30 sec. buffer meaning you hit button to activate it starts recording from the 30 secs prior to activation as soon as they are taken out of dock they go into a standby mode. 

To fire across your partner means something really made the Officer think he or his partner were in danger it will be interesting to hear the official statement as to what it was exactly that startled the officers causing the reaction.

 

 

13 minutes ago, TheDivineHustle said:

Not exactly true. 

 

By definition, a homicide is the deliberate and unlawful killing of one person by another. It's a synonym for murder. Self-defense can be considered homicide, but it would depend on the circumstances surrounding each individual case.

Yes and either way murder is illegal if you shoot someone it is a deliberate action caused by you a human towards another human regardless the reason if they die it's a homicide it's up to the DA to decided after reviewing the case circumstances and evidence whether or not to pursue charges of murder or lesser degrees such as manslaughter or to rule it as a justified homicide.

 

I've worked three homicides this month it's dirty and not fun.

 

 

Edited July 19, 20178 yr by SCRTAGNT69

25 minutes ago, SCRTAGNT69 said:

To fire across your partner means something really made the Officer think he or his partner were in danger it will be interesting to hear the official statement as to what it was exactly that startled the officers causing the reaction.

 

I'm almost willing to bet the other officer was just taken off-guard by being approached at their car  and overreacted.  Seriously, shooting a gun in your partner's face!  This is NEVER advised, taught, or even mentioned in training.  Why?  It's stupid and reckless!  If this had been a reported shots fired call, someone with a gun, or some type of extreme situation, I could maybe understand it.  This was a concerned citizen calling in, and she became a victim because of a trigger happy cop.  I can't help but wonder if this officer has severe PTSD or some other mental illness.  Not even a day 1 police officer would be stupid enough to do what this one did.

Edited July 19, 20178 yr by Kallus Rourke

Without mentioning the fact that firing a weapon inside a car is hazardous at best. The cartridge is very hot when ejected from the gun, what if it ignited a seat or an easily inflammable plastic in the vehicle?

So, is it established now that this wasn't a negligent discharge?

 

8 hours ago, Kallus Rourke said:

'm almost willing to bet the other officer was just taken off-guard by being approached at their car  and overreacted.

"Overreacted" is a bit too light, in my opinion. If this was a deliberate reaction, I wonder how this officer made it through the selection process and the academy.

He risked his partners life and his own! Could have narrowly missed or ricocheted!  Its ridiculous them not being able to get a statement. I'm pretty sure its standard procedure when an officer kills someone. 

 

 

On 7/19/2017 at 4:38 PM, TheDivineHustle said:

Not exactly true. 

 

By definition, a homicide is the deliberate and unlawful killing of one person by another. It's a synonym for murder. Self-defense can be considered homicide, but it would depend on the circumstances surrounding each individual case.

No a homicide is any killing, that's why a shooting in self defense in stand your ground states is called a justifiable homicide.

On 7/19/2017 at 8:40 PM, Hystery said:

Without mentioning the fact that firing a weapon inside a car is hazardous at best. The cartridge is very hot when ejected from the gun, what if it ignited a seat or an easily inflammable plastic in the vehicle?

It doesn't do that, I haven't taken the course yet, but over at Sig Sauer Academy they have an entire lot of classes specifically for shooting inside of cars. One of my best friends has taken a few of those classes for shooting in cars.

 

Shooting in cars happens more often than you think, and here's a situation where the trooper does it with a rifle https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6c5_1478044259

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From everything that I've seen guys, this is definitely unjustified. I'm pretty sure you guys are smart enough to know why their body cams were off, which isn't nefarious like a lot of people want to believe.

Edited July 22, 20178 yr by crkinnh

http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/21/us/minneapolis-police-chief-resigns/index.html

 

Mayor Betsy Hodges said she asked Harteau to resign because "I've lost confidence in the chief's ability to lead us further -- and from the many conversations I've had with people around our city, especially this week, it is clear that she has lost the confidence of the people of Minneapolis as well."

 

After an officer on her watch shot a gun point blank at an innocent person and in front of his partner's face, I'd certainly hope they'd lose confidence.

 

I'd also like to point something out:

 

Ruszczyk's death didn't lead to street protests

 

If this had been a slightly different scenario, I guarantee you there'd of been riots in the street.

23 minutes ago, crkinnh said:

No a homicide is any killing, that's why a shooting in self defense in stand your ground states is called a justifiable homicide.

It doesn't do that, I haven't taken the course yet, but over at Sig Sauer Academy they have an entire lot of classes specifically for shooting inside of cars. One of my best friends has taken a few of those classes for shooting in cars.

 

Shooting in cars happens more often than you think, and here's a situation where the trooper does it with a rifle https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6c5_1478044259

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From everything that I've seen guys, this is definitely unjustified. I'm pretty sure you guys are smart enough to know why their body cams were off, which isn't nefarious like a lot of people want to believe.

hom·i·cide

[ˈhäməˌsīd]

NOUN

1.  

   the deliberate and unlawful killing of one person by another; murder:

    

   The deliberate and unlawful killing, not just killing someone. Unless the dictionary definition is wrong and needs to be updated.

    

   I am in no way questioning your intelligence. It's just that I can't stand to believe something when evidence is literally pointing elsewhere. If you tell me to go left and everything else under the sun is telling me to go right, I'm going to go right.

Edited July 22, 20178 yr by TheDivineHustle

To be entirely fair:

 

"Homicide is the act of one human killing another. Homicides can be divided into many overlapping legal categories, including murder, manslaughter, justifiable homicide, killing in war, euthanasia, and capital punishment, depending on the circumstances of the death. These different types of homicides are often treated very differently in human societies; some are considered crimes, while others are permitted or even ordered by the legal system."

 

The simplest and most direct definition of a homicide is just that. A human killing another. After that point, that's just semantics. He's talking about the homicide in the broad meaning of the term, while you're talking about the more legal approach of the homicide. Both are correct.

Edited July 22, 20178 yr by Hystery