July 7th, 2014 - Eric Garner, a black man well known in the Staten Island community he was born in and raised, was strangled to death by an NYPD Cop, Daniel Pantaleo, during an encounter in a Staten Island community. Initially, Eric Garner was accused by the Police of selling cigarettes illegally, a practice he had been cited/arrested for in the past nearly 30 times. The situation escalated with the police eventually having to tackle the large man to the ground. Today, after 8 weeks of deliberation, the NYC based grand jury returned a Not Guilty indictment for the Officer, declaring there not enough evidence to indict on the proposed murder charges.

 

Now I ask, what do you think of the incident? The use of force? The indictment?

 

<opinion> 

 

If I may insert my opinion, I'd say overall, this was quite an appalling procedure to me which easily could've been averted. 

 

The choke hold, a take down procedure banned by the NYPD in 1995 (Fact check me, I might be wrong) should have not been used here, at least in my opinion. From the video, I think the man, while at times, being verbally aggressive, isn't exhibiting physical aggression towards the officers. Do take into account the camera angles are at times, difficult to view. However, it appears when on the ground, Mr. Garner is not flailing, is not rolling around, is not fighting back in any visible form yet the police officer in question continues the strangle hold. At one point, Mr. Garner expresses he cannot breath several times, and at some point within the next few minutes, dies. 

 

There was adequate backup on scene, Mr. Garner was physically passive, and the Chokehold was against NYPD practice. 

 

The New York City coroner ruled Eric Garner's Death a Homicide, citing compression of the neck and chest while in chokehold is what killed Mr. Garner. 

 

For what it's worth, I strongly supported the Not-Guilty Verdict of Officer Wilson during his time at the Ferguson, MO Police Department. However, I am quite appalled at not so much the verdict (As an indictment is difficult, especially on LEOs), but the combined Officer's actions to take down Eric Garner. It seemed unwarranted, and excessive in my eyes. 

 

Letting me down once again NYPD, smh. 

 

</opinion>

Edited December 5, 201411 yr by Mr.Quiggles

I think he used way to much excessive force. But had he not been selling illegal cigarettes this would've never happened.

I was on the fence about the Ferguson case.This one however, I believe the officer should have been charged. There was too much excessive force, the guy was literally yelling "I can't breathe." I just don't understand how the jury could dismiss that.

 

I hate how the media are quick to imply it was racially driven. Just because they are of different ethnicities, there could've been many other factors, including the sheer size of the man.

You know the Eric garner family is suing for $75 million dollars?!? I feel bad that the guy died and it's tragic but come on now 75 million dollars, that just being greedy in my opinion, not necessary.

Also question guys, I've people talking about being arrested

1. The police are supposed to tell you what they're arresting you for, it's your right.

2. If the police are arresting you, they don't have to tell you and you have to wait until you get down to the station.

Which one is the right one?

I mean, sure, yeah it's common sense to follow orders that the police give out but it's also common sense to not choke a guy to fuckin' death.

You know the Eric garner family is suing for $75 million dollars?!? I feel bad that the guy died and it's tragic but come on now 75 million dollars, that just being greedy in my opinion, not necessary.

Also question guys, I've people talking about being arrested

1. The police are supposed to tell you what they're arresting you for, it's your right.

2. If the police are arresting you, they don't have to tell you and you have to wait until you get down to the station.

Which one is the right one?

 

In the immediate moment they do not have to tell you why you're being arrested. Generally, they will worry about taking the person into custody first. Nor do will you have your rights read to you unless they plan on asking you testimonial questions. (I.E. they can ask you your name and routine booking questions)

 

As for the use of force here, I believe it was justified in terms of it not being a criminal action. You have to do what you have to do to effect an arrest. While the choke hold is banned by NYPD doesn't mean it's illegal, that is only a policy. Additionally, his death was caused, largely, due to his health. Please watch the video and hold your breath for the time he is in the choke hold. It's not long. If you don't have the health to fight the police then don't.

 

With this in mind I don't agree with the choke hold, it's not something I would use. But within the parameters of the law it is not a crime. And I expect the family will get a very large sum of money as they will be compensated for their loss and a large punitive damage will be awarded to discourage officers from using choke holds or what may be used as "excessive force" and also with all the pressure from the media i'm sure the damages will be inflated.

Protests continued Thursday over a grand jury's decision not to indict a white NYPD police officer, Daniel Pantaleo, in the chokehold death of an unarmed black man, Eric Garner. Yahoo News is providing live updates of the second day of demonstrations and rallies in New York City and around the country.

http://news.yahoo.com/eric-garner-grand-jury-decision-nyc-protests-day-2-154941705.html

 

I'm becoming a bit concerned about all this hate towards Police recently.

Riots are not gonna happen. If you noticed yesterday before the Christmas Tree Lighting, most of the protest are peaceful and are in compliant to NYPD, in fact NYPD are helping them by stopping traffic to let them cross the street and such. I saw them on the way home when I passed through Grand Central. Not violent in any sense. 

Why does the media & people always say a white officer and a black man? Skin color has nothing to do with this in my opinion!

 

 

I am also concerned.

I do not like the current NY mayor, De Blasio. He's practically a co-mayor, and he is essentially supporting hate against the police. Not to mention, he's always late and runs red lights in the city... But that's beside the point.

I want him out of office so bad. He has done no good, in my eyes, for our beautiful city, and I would like to see someone responsible, like Bloomberg, step back in.

 

May I ask, who looks like the mayor here?

I am also concerned.

I do not like the current NY mayor, De Blasio. He's practically a co-mayor, and he is essentially supporting hate against the police. Not to mention, he's always late and runs red lights in the city... But that's beside the point.

 

Forget the mayor! Look at the President! And AG Holder! Their doing everything they can NOT to support the officers, (Fergy and NYC), despite the fact that a jury of their peers proved that they were not in the wrong. A civil rights investigation?! Really!!??!? Skin color means jack squat here. The fact of the matter is that both of these men (who happen to be African American) were in the wrong! EMT's were on scene and did not treat Garner because he was saying "I can't breath!" IF YOU'RE TALKING, YOU'RE BREATHING!

Typical media, making every cop case a race thing, pitiful, we all know that if this story got so much publicity because it was a white man and a black civilian. Poor Eric, I feel bad for his family, he did NOT deserve to die.

Why does the media & people always say a white officer and a black man? Skin color has nothing to do with this in my opinion!

 

its because they are trying to ignite a race war that's all that's being thrown around in news articles black officer white officer 5 black jurors 7 white jurors black this white this blah blah blah that's why I don't pay attention to the so called "news"

Forget the mayor! Look at the President! And AG Holder! Their doing everything they can NOT to support the officers, (Fergy and NYC), despite the fact that a jury of their peers proved that they were not in the wrong. A civil rights investigation?! Really!!??!? Skin color means jack squat here. The fact of the matter is that both of these men (who happen to be African American) were in the wrong! EMT's were on scene and did not treat Garner because he was saying "I can't breath!" IF YOU'RE TALKING, YOU'RE BREATHING!

 

al Sharpton and odumbo are race baiters

MODERATOR NOTICE
Second topic about the indictment and riots surrounding it has merged with this one.

I usually support the officer or deputy but in my eyes this one is not justified at all.

I also agree this is another example of the racial industrial complex our nation finds itself struggling today.  Race had nothing to do with this incident, once again....  Without addressing the police state NY has become, anyone else have an issue with the way EMT/Paramedics handled that incident.  I don't have the training, but common sense says that if you respond to an incident and the patient is complaining about not being able to breathe you would put them on O2.  I'm sure there are exceptions to the rule but for the most part I would think that would be a reasonable common sense approach.  They just seemed to be very casual about everything, no sense of urgency.  I thought I saw her take his pulse but I don't remember her even checking his airway?  Any working as a EMT/Paramedic correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel proper life saving measures taken immediately probably would have saved his life.  If you're a first responder you can't afford to get complacent in the job.  Whether you're a FF, EMT/Paramedic, or Police Officer, complacency kills.

Even GTA EMTs did a better job than those ones.

Just don't get it. The cop strangled the man to death for no reason. In my world they call it a murder, and I sure don't give a damn that he was arguing with the cops or selling without a license. That's gone too far. Fire and prosecute the murderer, for God's sake, he's a maniac. 

 

I always support LEOs and officials because I understand the importance of their job and all what comes with it. But this... Saying that it's OK to choke a man on purpose just to punish him for being rude opens up a great world of possibilities where we don't need courts or prisons. 

I also agree this is another example of the racial industrial complex our nation finds itself struggling today.  Race had nothing to do with this incident, once again....  Without addressing the police state NY has become, anyone else have an issue with the way EMT/Paramedics handled that incident.  I don't have the training, but common sense says that if you respond to an incident and the patient is complaining about not being able to breathe you would put them on O2.  I'm sure there are exceptions to the rule but for the most part I would think that would be a reasonable common sense approach.  They just seemed to be very casual about everything, no sense of urgency.  I thought I saw her take his pulse but I don't remember her even checking his airway?  Any working as a EMT/Paramedic correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel proper life saving measures taken immediately probably would have saved his life.  If you're a first responder you can't afford to get complacent in the job.  Whether you're a FF, EMT/Paramedic, or Police Officer, complacency kills.

 

Complacency.

Criminals fake medical conditions all the time, ranging from difficulty breathing, to chest pains, to faking seizures, etc. I've even heard a suspect say he had AIDS that was acting up and needed to go to the hospital right away.

 

It's like they think that if they are sick they will just go to the hospital and then be released to go home.

 

So a lot of officers and EMT's can get callous and seem uncaring when a criminal claims to have a medical issue during the arrest., because they hear the same thing every day from liars that are wasting their time and effort, tying up emergency response personnel, and putting innocent people that are experiencing legitimate medical conditions at risk by doing so.

Despite that, every claim of medical issue is treated seriously, which is why the medics were called for Eric Garner.

Don't get me wrong, Mr. Garner didn't deserve to die. But, I also believe his death is just the end result of his poor choices. He chose to break the law multiple times. He'd been arrested more than 30 times for various crimes including assault and grand larceny, and at the time of this incident he was out on bail after being arrested for illegally selling cigarettes, driving without a license, possession of marijuana, and false impersonation. He then chose to break the law again by continuing to sell cigarettes and resisting arrest when he got caught again. The police are allowed to use physical force to arrest you if you do not comply with their verbal commands, which is why the officer wasn't indicted. Garner also wasn't asphyxiated, he died from cardiac arrest in the ambulance.The officer didn't break the law, so he couldn't be charged with a crime since he didn't commit one.

If Mr. Garner had chosen not to break the law or chosen not to resist arrest that day, he would still be alive today.

Just don't get it. The cop strangled the man to death for no reason. In my world they call it a murder, and I sure don't give a damn that he was arguing with the cops or selling without a license. That's gone too far. Fire and prosecute the murderer, for God's sake, he's a maniac. 

 

I always support LEOs and officials because I understand the importance of their job and all what comes with it. But this... Saying that it's OK to choke a man on purpose just to punish him for being rude opens up a great world of possibilities where we don't need courts or prisons. 

 

The grand jury found that the cop did NOT strangle Garner to death. Garner died from cardiac arrest in the ambulance on the way to the hospital. The grand jury determined that he officer applied reasonable force using a technique he was taught in the academy to subdue a suspect that was resisting a lawful arrest.

 

You are welcome to believe that it was wrong, but your belief does not make it illegal. The 23 people on the grand jury who were presented with all of the evidence and facts determined that no crime was committed as defined by law.

Complacency.

Criminals fake medical conditions all the time, ranging from difficulty breathing, to chest pains, to faking seizures, etc. I've even heard a suspect say he had AIDS that was acting up and needed to go to the hospital right away.

 

It's like they think that if they are sick they will just go to the hospital and then be released to go home.

 

So a lot of officers and EMT's can get callous and seem uncaring when a criminal claims to have a medical issue during the arrest., because they hear the same thing every day from liars that are wasting their time and effort, tying up emergency response personnel, and putting innocent people that are experiencing legitimate medical conditions at risk by doing so.

Despite that, every claim of medical issue is treated seriously, which is why the medics were called for Eric Garner.

Don't get me wrong, Mr. Garner didn't deserve to die. But, I also believe his death is just the end result of his poor choices. He chose to break the law multiple times. He'd been arrested more than 30 times for various crimes including assault and grand larceny, and at the time of this incident he was out on bail after being arrested for illegally selling cigarettes, driving without a license, possession of marijuana, and false impersonation. He then chose to break the law again by continuing to sell cigarettes and resisting arrest when he got caught again. The police are allowed to use physical force to arrest you if you do not comply with their verbal commands, which is why the officer wasn't indicted. Garner also wasn't asphyxiated, he died from cardiac arrest in the ambulance.The officer didn't break the law, so he couldn't be charged with a crime since he didn't commit one.

If Mr. Garner had chosen not to break the law or chosen not to resist arrest that day, he would still be alive today.

 

The grand jury found that the cop did NOT strangle Garner to death. Garner died from cardiac arrest in the ambulance on the way to the hospital. The grand jury determined that he officer applied reasonable force using a technique he was taught in the academy to subdue a suspect that was resisting a lawful arrest.

 

You are welcome to believe that it was wrong, but your belief does not make it illegal. The 23 people on the grand jury who were presented with all of the evidence and facts determined that no crime was committed as defined by law.

 

But, doesn't new york law state you can't use a choke hole?