So what do you think the world would be like if World War I & II had not have happened. Would we be as technogically (I forget how to spell that) advanced. Would we have as much crime? Would we be at the same state, financially, as we are now? So for those who don't know, World War I, known as the Great War, was started in 1914 and lasted until 1918. It is known as one of the deadliest conflicts in history, and paved the way for major political changes. The two sides were the Allies (UK, France and Russia) and the Central Powers of Germany and Austria-Hungary. Italy had joined the Central Powers and didn't join the allies as the Central Powers  had taken the offensive to the allies. Over 70,000,000 military units were mobilised, making it one of the largest wars in history.

 

It all started in Sarajevo, when Yugoslavian nationalist, Gavrilo Princip, assassinated Archduke Franz Ferdinand, heir to the throne of Austria. On 28 July 1914, the Austro-Hungarians declared war on Serbia and invaded. Russia mobilised in support of Serbia, Germany invaded Belgium and Luxembourg, both of which were neutral countries, before moving to France. This led to Britain declaring war on Germany. The German march on Paris was halted, on what was known as the German Front, with a trench line that would change over the next few years, up until 1917. On the Eastern Front, the Russians were successful against the Austro-Hungarians but was stopped in its invasion of east Prussia by the Germans. In November 1914, the Ottoman Empire joined the Central Powers, opening fronts in the Caucasus, Mesopotamia and Sinai regions. Italy joined the Allies in 1915 and Bulgaria joined the Central Powers in the same year. Romania joined the Allies in 1916, and the US joined them in 1917.

 

The Russian government collapsed in 1917. After a German offensive in 1918 along the Western Front, the Allies drove back the German's in a series of offenses and began to enter the trenches. On 4th November 1918, the Austro-Hungarian empire agreed to a truce, and Germany agreed to a truce on the 11th, thus giving the Allies the victory after 4 long years of conflict.

 

At the end of the war, the German, Russian, Austro-Hungarian and Ottoman empires ceased to exist. The Germans and Russian lost a lot of valuable territory while the Austro-Hungarian and Ottoman empires were dismantled. The League of Nations was formed to prevent this kind of conflict again. However, they failed and in 1939, World War II had began.

 

The Second World War lasted from 1939 and ended in 1945. It involved two sided. The allies, and the Axis. It was the most widespread war in history, involving over 100,000,000 people from over 30 countries. In a state of total war the major participants threw all of their capabilities into the war effort, erasing the distinction between civilian and military resources. Including the Holocaust and the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, World War 2 resulted in 50,000,000 to 85,000,000 casualties, many of which were civilians, which made it the deadliest conflict in human history. The Empire of Japan was at war with the Republic of China in 1937, but the War is said to have started in 1939, with Germany's invasion of Poland. and declarations of war by France and the UK. From 1939 to 1941, Germany conquered most of continental Europe and formed the Axis Alliance with Italy and Japan. Following the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, Germany and the Soviet Union partitioned and seized the territories of other countries in Europe, including Poland and Finland. The UK and British Commonwealth were the only Allied Forces continuing the fight against the Axis, with campaigns in Africa as well as the long running Battle of the Atlantic. In June 1941 the European Axis launched an invasion on the Soviet Union, leading to the largest land theatre of war in history. On December 1941, Japan launched an invasion on the US, including the Attack on Pearl Harbour, and European territories in the Pacific Ocean, including Malaya. The Axis invasion was halted in 1942 when Japan lost the Battle of Midway to the US and the Axis were defeated in Africa by the British, and at Stalingrad by the Soviets. In 1943 there was a series of German defeats on the Eastern Front, and the Allied Invasion of Italy, which took place in Sicily, and had brought Italian surrender. After this the Axis lost initiative and retreated on all fronts. In 1944 the Western Allies invaded France, while the Soviets regained its losses and invaded Germany. During 1944 and 1945 the Japanese suffered major losses in Asia while the Allies crippled the Imperial Japanese Navy and captured key Western Pacific island. The war in Europe ended by the Allies and Soviets, namely the Polish and Russian troops, captured Berlin, and the unconditional surrender of Germany on 8 May 1945. Following the Potsdam Declaration by the allies on 26 July, the US dropped atomic bombs on the Japanese cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki on the 6th and 9th of August. With an invasion of Japan imminent and the possibility of more atomic bombings, and the Soviet Unions declaration of war on Japan, the Japanese surrendered on 15 August 1945. Thus ending the war on the Pacific front and the final destruction on the Axis.

 

After the war, the United Nations (UN) was established to raise international co operation and prevent future conflicts. The victorious great powers, US, Soviet Union, China, UK and France, became the permanent members of the United Nations Security Council. The Soviet Union and United States emerged as rival superpowers, setting the stage for the Cold War (Which I'm not getting into, this post is long enough), which lasted for 46 years. Meanwhile, the influence of the European great powers declined, while the decolonisation of Asia and Africa began. Most countries whose industries had been damaged moved towards economic recovery.

 

So after spending a good 30 minutes typing all that, what do you think the effects of the World Wars was? Would we be better off without them? Would we be more technically advanced as we would not have spent 40 years fighting wars and spent it on technological advances? State your opinion on this

The Japanese never launched an invasion on the United States. The plan was to knock out the American Pacific fleet so they'd be free to conquer Asia and Oceania, they never intended to take over/eliminate the American homeland. 

 

That aside though, I believe wars create technology. Without World War II, a lot of the modern technology we take for granted today may have never existed because there would have been no need for that technology to exist. 

The Japanese never launched an invasion on the United States. The plan was to knock out the American Pacific fleet so they'd be free to conquer Asia and Oceania, they never intended to take over/eliminate the American homeland. 

 

That aside though, I believe wars create technology. Without World War II, a lot of the modern technology we take for granted today may have never existed because there would of been no need that technology to exist. 

True, would we have radios, TV, computers, jet aircraft? Would we have first person shooters?

Yeah in my opinion we needed world war 1 and 2, here's why:

For WW1, without we would not have discovered all the amazing technology we had, poison gas, machine gun, tanks all that good stuff. Plus it really showed how the world would react to such a massive war.

For WW2, we needed that so we could get rid of nazi Germany and get rid the dictatorships in both Japan and Italy, plus without it the world may be a very different place.

Yeah in my opinion we needed world war 1 and 2, here's why:

For WW1, without we would not have discovered all the amazing technology we had, poison gas, machine gun, tanks all that good stuff. Plus it really showed how the world would react to such a massive war.

For WW2, we needed that so we could get rid of nazi Germany and get rid the dictatorships in both Japan and Italy, plus without it the world may be a very different place.

You forget other technological advancements like Radios, TV's, Computers, Jet Aircraft, Video Games (We wouldn't have COD or Battlefield without War

For WW1, without we would not have discovered all the amazing technology we had, poison gas, machine gun, tanks all that good stuff. Plus it really showed how the world would react to such a massive war.

 

With all due respect, I don't think that poison gas, machine gun and other tanks are "good stuff". Personal opinion, of course.

With all due respect, I don't think that poison gas, machine gun and other tanks are "good stuff". Personal opinion, of course.

When you have 50 guys with machine guns running at you a tank is a good stuff

When you have 50 guys with machine guns running at you a tank is a good stuff

 

Anything that has for only purpose to kill other human beings can't really be considered as "good stuff".

Without WW2 I don't think we would have had the Geneva convention. As a result, every war big or small would just have crazy high death tolls. Borders would be very different, and in most cases, that would not be. A good thing. So I think we are better off with those wars

Anything that has for only purpose to kill other human beings can't really be considered as "good stuff".

I know, I was joking

World War II never would have happened, had the victorious nations not followed french minister Clemenceau's plans but Woodrow Wilson's. Wilson's plan would have tried to rebuild Germany and Austria while Clemenceau wanted to punish Germany and Austria due to german-french-antipathy.

As a matter of fact, it did make sense for Austria to start the war at the time. Serbia was just a small country that openly supported Gavrilo Princip after the assassination of Franz Ferdinand - quite similar to the US attacking Afghanistan because the Taliban regime supported Bin Laden. Assassinating Franz Ferdinand was almost like killing the US president at the time because Emperor Franz Joseph didn't have any male children (after Rudolph killed himself).

What Austria didn't know though was that france spun a network of alliances with Britain and other countries (the Entente). That ultimately resulted in a world war, like the OP posted.

So after all, Clemenceau has to take a huge part of why Hitler could gather so many allies at the time. Hitler himself fought in WW1 (and got wounded, that's why he never used poison gas) and thought he had to restore germany and austria (which would never have happened, had the victors followed Wilson).

 

But I think, while WW2 would have been preventable, these wars pushed us forward technologically. Jet turbines were invented, even nuclear fission was made accessable. Unfortunately, it seems that war pushes nations to invest more money into research.

Modern wars have pushed research for prosthetic limbs so that since 2001, prosthetic limbs have come a lot closer to those we know from Star Wars. Wars always push trauma medicine forward because doctors have to come up with new ways to save soldiers who have been wounded on the battlefield. Since 2001 and 2003, trauma medicine learned about cooling the head after traumatic head injuries (like a shot to the head) to reduce the speed of celular activity and therefore reduce the speed these cells die.

 

I think it is better to prevent wars and every war is cruel, especially on civilians, but at least we seem to learn new technologies from wars that otherwise might take a lot longer because nations wouldn't invest that much money in it. You see, during the cold war, the US and Russia did everything in their power to prove they're better than the other one. So they invested a huge amount of money into the conquering of space - which ultimately resulted in the US landing the first ever man on the moon. Now that there's no such big rival as russia at the time, the US has drastically reduced NASA's budget (a decision I find very troubling, space exploration is one of the most important scientific fields in my opinion, besides medicine).

 

So to sum it up again: I don't think we'd be better off without the world wars. Europe came together after WW2, we created the EU and now have the longest period of peace in european history.

I personally believe that while the world wars helped build alliances and unite most of the developed world, it also created bitter enemies. Nobody will ever know what the world would be like if the wars hadn't happened, because they did happen.

I know, I was joking

 

Just making sure, you never know with some people :c

World War II never would have happened, had the victorious nations not followed french minister Clemenceau's plans but Woodrow Wilson's. Wilson's plan would have tried to rebuild Germany and Austria while Clemenceau wanted to punish Germany and Austria due to german-french-antipathy.

As a matter of fact, it did make sense for Austria to start the war at the time. Serbia was just a small country that openly supported Gavrilo Princip after the assassination of Franz Ferdinand - quite similar to the US attacking Afghanistan because the Taliban regime supported Bin Laden. Assassinating Franz Ferdinand was almost like killing the US president at the time because Emperor Franz Joseph didn't have any male children (after Rudolph killed himself).

What Austria didn't know though was that france spun a network of alliances with Britain and other countries (the Entente). That ultimately resulted in a world war, like the OP posted.

So after all, Clemenceau has to take a huge part of why Hitler could gather so many allies at the time. Hitler himself fought in WW1 (and got wounded, that's why he never used poison gas) and thought he had to restore germany and austria (which would never have happened, had the victors followed Wilson).

 

But I think, while WW2 would have been preventable, these wars pushed us forward technologically. Jet turbines were invented, even nuclear fission was made accessable. Unfortunately, it seems that war pushes nations to invest more money into research.

Modern wars have pushed research for prosthetic limbs so that since 2001, prosthetic limbs have come a lot closer to those we know from Star Wars. Wars always push trauma medicine forward because doctors have to come up with new ways to save soldiers who have been wounded on the battlefield. Since 2001 and 2003, trauma medicine learned about cooling the head after traumatic head injuries (like a shot to the head) to reduce the speed of celular activity and therefore reduce the speed these cells die.

 

I think it is better to prevent wars and every war is cruel, especially on civilians, but at least we seem to learn new technologies from wars that otherwise might take a lot longer because nations wouldn't invest that much money in it. You see, during the cold war, the US and Russia did everything in their power to prove they're better than the other one. So they invested a huge amount of money into the conquering of space - which ultimately resulted in the US landing the first ever man on the moon. Now that there's no such big rival as russia at the time, the US has drastically reduced NASA's budget (a decision I find very troubling, space exploration is one of the most important scientific fields in my opinion, besides medicine).

 

So to sum it up again: I don't think we'd be better off without the world wars. Europe came together after WW2, we created the EU and now have the longest period of peace in european history.

I knew Hitler fought in WW1, I learned all about World War I & World War II extensively in school, war has its upsides and downsides. It is worse in the short term as many people die (Many million in the World Wars), but it is better in the long term, as in the long term we get better scientific advances, would we have the kind of medicines we have today if research wasn't put in to help soldiers who were shot in battle? Would we have high tech computers that help stop missiles?

Yeah in my opinion we needed world war 1 and 2, here's why:

For WW1, without we would not have discovered all the amazing technology we had, poison gas, machine gun, tanks all that good stuff. Plus it really showed how the world would react to such a massive war.

For WW2, we needed that so we could get rid of nazi Germany and get rid the dictatorships in both Japan and Italy, plus without it the world may be a very different place.

 

Nazi Germany would have likely never come about had World War 1 never happened, or in the case of a German victory.

Without WW2 I don't think we would have had the Geneva convention. As a result, every war big or small would just have crazy high death tolls. Borders would be very different, and in most cases, that would not be. A good thing. So I think we are better off with those wars

The Geneva Convention hasn't done much in the way of saving lives in countless conflicts. Millions have died in wars since its adoption. 

 

 

 

 

The points above that war creates technology, while correct, I find problematic. Maybe we are better off with modern telecommunications or jet aircraft, but millions of human lives are steep price to pay for it. 

For one thing, we probably wouldn't be here typing this out on a PC, as without WW2 there would be no Enigma machine, so no Turing calculations, so along the line computers wouldn't exist as we know them, but probably still Fridge-size punch card machines. Also, we wouldn't have the Israel/Palestine conflict, as Israel wouldn't formally exist. Plus, without much of the economic disasters Germany and the axis suffered as a result of the loss of the wars, A strong German/Austria-Hungary empire would still exist (And maybe a British empire would still be around too) so a war between these would be almost inevitable.

With all due respect, I don't think that poison gas, machine gun and other tanks are "good stuff". Personal opinion, of course.

 

Well i disagree, i actually like those types of weapons, not to kill humans but to see as to what kind of effect they have. I'm not evil you know. 

Anything that has for only purpose to kill other human beings can't really be considered as "good stuff".

Well it depends on the circumstances.

 

With all due respect, I don't think that poison gas, machine gun and other tanks are "good stuff". Personal opinion, of course.

I respectfully disagree. Again, this strongly depends on the circumstances.

The Japanese never launched an invasion on the United States. The plan was to knock out the American Pacific fleet so they'd be free to conquer Asia and Oceania, they never intended to take over/eliminate the American homeland. 

 

That aside though, I believe wars create technology. Without World War II, a lot of the modern technology we take for granted today may have never existed because there would have been no need for that technology to exist. 

There's always the possibility that someone would have created it later anyways.

Interesting little thread. Without the World Wars i'd be living in the German Kaiserreich. that kinda sounds badass actually. The British Empire would prolly be still the most dominant force on the planet. And Hitler would prolly died as a poor artist in Austria without ever beeing noticed by anyone. So much stuff could be diffrent. Bad and Good.

Interesting little thread. Without the World Wars i'd be living in the German Kaiserreich. that kinda sounds badass actually. The British Empire would prolly be still the most dominant force on the planet. And Hitler would prolly died as a poor artist in Austria without ever beeing noticed by anyone. So much stuff could be diffrent. Bad and Good.

 

Most people on Earth believe Hitler was german and Beethoven was austrian ... Whoops

I think we austrians got away pretty fine