Something I just found out that proves yet another talking point wrong is that the dispatch audio Anonymous hacked and released was from St. Louis County Police, not Ferguson police who have their own frequency.

 

For those wondering what that talking point is, people are claiming based on the St. Louis County Police dispatch tapes that the shooting was never called in by Darren Wilson, when the tapes show St. Louis County Police informing their officers of what was going on in Ferguson over an hour later.

 

And on the video claiming to show Wilson pacing around, that woman claims it took her 30 seconds to get her phone and start taking video from the time the shots were fired.

 

Does anyone here really believe police tape would be up within 30 seconds of a police shooting?

Really you could argue that may not even be Wilson in the video considering that some claim he was injured during the incident.  One could argue that he had already been sent to get medical attention at the time that video had started. 

 

The other thing to note from that 10 minute video is very early on like in the first minute or two you hear the shots being described as rapid fire "bang, bang, bang, bang, bang"  That really doesn't sound like a situation where the officer fired once stopped and then continued to fire after the subject turned around and surrendered to me. That sounds more like him responding to a ~300 pound threat charging him after already assaulting him for an unknown reason. 

If this turns out to be a clean shoot, Ferguson will never be at peace. There will be absolutely no relationship between police and community.

On a personal note, is love to read each and every one of their faces when they announce it as a clean shoot (if it indeed was).

Yeah this is crazy, my aunt lives 15 minutes or so away from Ferguson. I was down in Missouri to visit her a few weeks ago and I was there when it happened! I also live in Canada so I'm no where near There.

The point is that his life actions have nothing to do with why he was shot.

 

Indirectly, they do. They establish the type of individual he was, plus give hints as to how he would react if confronted by the cops just after allegedly committing a crime.

 

The direct reason he was shot was because he was involved in an altercation with the officer. When it comes time, it'll hopefully be possible to determine if that altercation justified the lethal force employed.

Indirectly, they do. They establish the type of individual he was, plus give hints as to how he would react if confronted by the cops just after allegedly committing a crime.

 

The direct reason he was shot was because he was involved in an altercation with the officer. When it comes time, it'll hopefully be possible to determine if that altercation justified the lethal force employed.

 

Did you read my following post to the one you quoted?   We are saying the same thing. 

 

Hey guys I have a question, do st. Louis police carry tazers?

Hey guys I have a question, do st. Louis police carry tazers?

 

Yes, but I would imagine that's not really relevant to the point I think you're trying to make.

 

The St. Louis County and City police officers both look like they have Tasers, but they were not involved in the shooting. The City of Ferguson has it's own police department. A quick Google search shows some Ferguson officers with Tasers and some with out, so there's probably no way to know whether Officer Wilson had one or not, short of asking him. 

 

And before you try to make the point, NO, Officer Wilson probably could not and should not have attempted to Tase Mr. Brown. Based on the facts and forensic evidence that have been presented since the shooting, Mr. Brown had passed the level of force where a Taser would have been appropriate.

 

Police are trained to use a level of force above what the suspect is using, and if Officer Wilson reasonably believed that Mr. Brown posed a lethal threat, then using a Taser would have been inappropriate and could have resulted in Officer Wilson being further injured or killed.

 

Wilson had his firearm drawn following the physical fight with Brown. In order for him to switch to a Taser when Brown turned around and began charging him again, Wilson would have had to holster the firearm, move to the other side of his duty belt to un snap and draw the Taser, flick the safety switch off, and then try to line up a shot and fire. Practicing that motion myself, it takes me about 3 seconds to make those movements, and I'm not in pain, under duress, or impaired by an adrenaline rush. It also takes me about 3 seconds to run 30 feet, the distance that some people have estimated Brown was from Wilson when the shots were fired. So, if Wilson had attempted to switch to a Taser, it's likely that Brown could have closed the distance before Wilson had the opportunity to use the Taser, and Brown could have assaulted Wilson again and killed him this time.

 

Even if Wilson would have been able to draw a Taser and get on target, Taser's are not 100% effective. Probes miss, baggy clothing can render it ineffective, Tasers fail, some people are able to fight through the charge, especially if the probes did not make good contact. There are numerous reasons why Tasers fail, and those are the reasons that a Taser is only trained to be used under low risk situations where a Taser failure would not result in increased risk to anyone.

Edited August 21, 201411 yr by johnclark1102

Yes, but I would imagine that's not really relevant to the point I think you're trying to make.

The St. Louis County and City police officers both look like they have Tasers, but they were not involved in the shooting. The City of Ferguson has it's own police department. A quick Google search shows some Ferguson officers with Tasers and some with out, so there's probably no way to know whether Officer Wilson had one or not, short of asking him.

And before you try to make the point, NO, Officer Wilson probably could not and should not have attempted to Tase Mr. Brown. Based on the facts and forensic evidence that have been presented since the shooting, Mr. Brown had passed the level of force where a Taser would have been appropriate.

Police are trained to use a level of force above what the suspect is using, and if Officer Wilson reasonably believed that Mr. Brown posed a lethal threat, then using a Taser would have been inappropriate and could have resulted in Officer Wilson being further injured or killed.

Wilson had his firearm drawn following the physical fight with Brown. In order for him to switch to a Taser when Brown turned around and began charging him again, Wilson would have had to holster the firearm, move to the other side of his duty belt to un snap and draw the

Taser, flick the safety switch off, and then try to line up a shot and fire. Practicing that motion myself, it takes me about 3 seconds to make those movements, and I'm not in pain, under duress, or impaired by an adrenaline rush. It also takes me about 3 seconds to run 30 feet, the distance that some people have estimated Brown was from Wilson when the shots were fired. So, if Wilson had attempted to switch to a Taser, it's likely that Brown could have closed the distance before Wilson had the opportunity to use the Taser, and Brown could have assaulted Wilson again and killed him this time.

Even if Wilson would have been able to draw a Taser and get on target, Taser's are not 100% effective. Probes miss, baggy clothing can render it ineffective, Tasers fail, some people are able to fight through the charge, especially if the probes did not make good contact. There are numerous reasons why Tasers fail, and those are the reasons that a Taser is only trained to be used under low risk situations where a Taser failure would not result in increased risk to anyone.

Thank you, I asked this because of another case I saw in St. Louis but I'm not going to post it, because I don't want to start another debate.

Thank you, I asked this because of another case I saw in St. Louis but I'm not going to post it, because I don't want to start another debate.

 

If it's the shooting that took place a day or two ago where the suspect was armed with a knife, the same logic applies.

 

Knife = Deadly Force, therefore, Police Response = Deadly Force

 

That was also the St. Louis Metropolitan PD I believe, (City of St. Louis).

Edited August 21, 201411 yr by johnclark1102

If it's the shooting that took place a day or two ago where the suspect was armed with a knife, the same logic applies.

Knife = Deadly Force, therefore, Police Response = Deadly Force

That was also the St. Louis Metropolitan PD I believe, (City of St. Louis).

In my opoioin if I was that offcier I would've tazed the suspect and let the other offcier subdue the man, but I'm no police offcier so I can't make those decisions.

In my opoioin if I was that offcier I would've tazed the suspect and let the other offcier subdue the man, but I'm no police offcier so I can't make those decisions.

 

Are you willing to put your life in the tasers hands?  I wouldnt.  It is proven that tasers do not always work. They are electronic and sometimes fail.  Sometimes the prongs don't connect.  Sometimes they get caught in clothing.  Sometime the prongs miss altogether.  Then what?  Some people are not affected by them when they are amped up on drugs. Do you know for sure what the suspect is on at the time? You don't as you have not been with this person all day to see what they have been ingesting.  

 

When someone has a knife they could kill you.  One luck swipe can get an artery on your leg or in your neck during a struggle.  Game over.  No re-do's.  Is that a chance you're willing to take?

 

This is what officers face every day.  Most like yourself monday morning quarterback their decisions when they have no LE training.  They say "I would have done this and that"....and we say "this and that could have gotten you killed.  If you had LE knowledge and training you would know that."

 

You're entitled to your opinion, but you seem young and inexperienced in your knowledge of how law enforcement operates and with life in general.  This is not a bad thing as you probably have not had the chance to be taught this stuff, but I caution you when giving your opinion like you did when you don't really know what your talking about.  This is a rather important life lesson you will learn someday, hopefully it is not the hard way.

 

If you wish to pursue an LEO career, you have a lot to learn.  Once you learn it you will understand that a knife is deadly force and will almost always be met by deadly force by the police as Sheriff Shaw said above.  A gun is not electronic and rarely rarely ever fails.  When a suspect has a knife and is within 40 ft of me and they are refusing to drop it.... I will alway have my firearm ready to defend my life as well as others.  Period.

Are you willing to put your life in the tasers hands? I wouldnt. It is proven that tasers do not always work. They are electronic and sometimes fail. Sometimes the prongs don't connect. Sometimes they get caught in clothing. Sometime the prongs miss altogether. Then what? Some people are not affected by them when they are amped up on drugs. Do you know for sure what the suspect is on at the time? You don't as you have not been with this person all day to see what they have been ingesting.

When someone has a knife they could kill you. One luck swipe can get an artery on your leg or in your neck during a struggle. Game over. No re-do's. Is that a chance you're willing to take?

This is what officers face every day. Most like yourself monday morning quarterback their decisions when they have no LE training. They say "I would have done this and that"....and we say "this and that could have gotten you killed. If you had LE knowledge and training you would know that."

You're entitled to your opinion, but you seem young and inexperienced in your knowledge of how law enforcement operates and with life in general. This is not a bad thing as you probably have not had the chance to be taught this stuff, but I caution you when giving your opinion like you did when you don't really know what your talking about. This is a rather important life lesson you will learn someday, hopefully it is not the hard way.

If you wish to pursue an LEO career, you have a lot to learn. Once you learn it you will understand that a knife is deadly force and will almost always be met by deadly force by the police as Sheriff Shaw said above. A gun is not electronic and rarely rarely ever fails. When a suspect has a knife and is within 40 ft of me and they are refusing to drop it.... I will alway have my firearm ready to defend my life as well as others. Period.

Okay you make a point there, and yes I'm young, finna be a junior in high school, I don't know much about law enforcement because I plan on studying computer science and being a Leo is too dangerous for me, thanks for not being mean in what you said.

I just found this out today, angry protesters confront Jesse Jackson saying when are going to stop selling us out? It confuses me because how is he selling you out when he's not involved in the protests?

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/08/22/jesse-jackson-cornered-by-angry-ferguson-protesters-when-you-going-to-stop-selling-us-out/

Edited August 23, 201411 yr by Chester199