An action like this would usually get no attention from mainstream media, but now, it has been covered. Jesse Kidder, a police officer from Ohio, was responding to a call  about a murder suspect in a neighborhood he was patrolling in. In a YouTube video capturing the incident, the suspect was charging towards the officer, yelling,"Kill me!" repeatedly, and even motions reaching for something in his pockets, an action that would mostly result in complete death for the average suspect. Kidder instructed the suspect to keep distance and put his hands up multiple times. The confrontation finally ended when the suspect seems to push the officer, causing him to fall down. After this, the suspect finally puts his hands up, resulting in a complete arrest. Jesse Kidder declared to various news organizations," I wanted to be absolutely sure before I used deadly force," The suspect in the video, one Michael Wilcox, is being charged with 2 counts of murder and resisting arrest. The bond is $2,000,000. Shortly after the affair, Kidder is now being looked up to as a national hero by the public, showing an example of a police officer "restraining" himself from shooting a suspect, until he is absolutely certain that it is necessary to use deadly force.

Thoughts?

Video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVQYgoXk2Nw

Articles:http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2015/0420/Ohio-cop-s-refusal-to-shoot-a-model-of-police-restraint-video

            http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3045243/Rookie-cop-praised-NOT-firing-murder-suspect-charged-threatened

            http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/04/19/jesse-kidder-police-officer_n_7097618.html

           http://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/officer-refuses-resort-deadly-force-i-wanted-be-absolutely-sure-n3440

          http://abcnews.go.com/US/shoot-suspect-screamed-officer-jesse-kidder-held-fire/story?id=30440807

         http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/19/us/ohio-new-richmond-officer-does-not-shoot-suspect/

         http://www.wlwt.com/news/officer-i-wanted-to-be-absolutely-sure-before-i-used-deadly-force/32436026

 

            

Edited July 13, 201510 yr by TheAntiCapitalist
Suspect never touched officer, removing assaulting police officer charge

Respect to the officer, i think most other cops would have shot him as he ran towards them.
The most annoying on this, are these comments which say that the suspect would have been shot if he was black.

Respect to the officer, i think most other cops would have shot him as he ran towards them.
The most annoying on this, are these comments which say that the suspect would have been shot if he was black.

I agree with that. Crime does not have any color, nor does honor.

In my opinion, any police officer should always find a way not to kill the suspect. You can shoot at legs or arms, disarm a suspect, if there is no explicit attempt with a gun. the officer did the right thing, though risky.

Edited July 11, 201510 yr by Zarezhu

It still angers me on how many people in the comments are still dissing the cop and cops in general. Ignorant people seem to always find a way to get the last word.. smh.

Mad respect to that cop.

Also are you sure it was two billion dollars on his bail? 

In my opinion, any police officer should always find a way not to kill the suspect. You can shoot at legs or arms, disarm a suspect, if there is no explicit attempt with a gun. the officer did the right thing, though risky.

Try explaining that to the US cops. They'll tell you that "there's no way to hit a leg/arm" or "it's too dangerous" or "the training is to shoot to the center of mass". Meanwhile our cops (I mean in Russia) somehow manage to aim arms and legs and successfully hit them. 

On the topic, the cop is an absolute example of a good cop. He could use some martial arts skills tho :)

Mad respect to that cop.

Also are you sure it was two billion dollars on his bail? 

That was two million dollars, but thank you for noticing the mistake.

Its rare to see a cop that's willing to risk their life for a suspect. Falling on your ass when you're a cop is embarrassing as hell, but he put aside his embarrassment and his anger and treated the situation rationally. A truly good police officer. A cop that CAN shoot but doesn't is 100x the police officer compared to a cop that shoots the first chance he gets.

Try explaining that to the US cops. They'll tell you that "there's no way to hit a leg/arm" or "it's too dangerous" or "the training is to shoot to the center of mass". Meanwhile our cops (I mean in Russia) somehow manage to aim arms and legs and successfully hit them. 

On the topic, the cop is an absolute example of a good cop. He could use some martial arts skills tho :)

If I felt my life was in danger, I would shoot to kill. Shooting an arm or a leg does not always stop a suspect, especially if they are on a strong drug.

In my opinion, any police officer should always find a way not to kill the suspect. You can shoot at legs or arms.

they are trained to shoot in the mid chest area not in the arms/legs and for obvious reasons.

Its rare to see a cop that's willing to risk their life for a suspect. Falling on your ass when you're a cop is embarrassing as hell, but he put aside his embarrassment and his anger and treated the situation rationally. A truly good police officer. A cop that CAN shoot but doesn't is 100x the police officer compared to a cop that shoots the first chance he gets.

He fell over? From the looks of the video, it looks like the suspect either punched him, or pushed him. Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks that way from the video. If the officer did fall over on his own, I'll change it.

If I felt my life was in danger, I would shoot to kill. Shooting an arm or a leg does not always stop a suspect, especially if they are on a strong drug.

It's your right do to whatever you feel must be done. I simply say our police much rarely uses lethal force, but then again, that's two different societies. Not many russian criminals will take a shot at a cop. 

He fell over? From the looks of the video, it looks like the suspect either punched him, or pushed him. Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks that way from the video. If the officer did fall over on his own, I'll change it.

Skip to 0:35. Watch at .25 speed. The guy never touched the officer, the officer fell because he backed up too quickly when the guy charged him.

A lot of my job is analyzing video. Its my little super-power haha.

 

Edited July 13, 201510 yr by Riley24

Skip to 0:35. Watch at .25 speed. The guy never touched the officer, the officer fell because he backed up too quickly when the guy charged him.

A lot of my job is analyzing video. Its my little super-power haha.

 

You're right, but the suspect is still being charged with resisting arrest.

You're right, but the suspect is still being charged with resisting arrest.

You don't have to lay a finger on an officer to be charged with that. Its a pretty standard charge. Now-a-days unless you listen to every word an officer says, you can be charged with resisting arrest even if the arrest is false.

But in this case he's clearly resisting arrest.

One day I hope this is standard practice. Americans are obsessed with shooting people. As soon as you're threatened, shoot shoot shoot. A coward shoots an unarmed man. A hero takes the risk of not killing.

Edited July 13, 201510 yr by Riley24

In my opinion, any police officer should always find a way not to kill the suspect. You can shoot at legs or arms, disarm a suspect, if there is no explicit attempt with a gun. the officer did the right thing, though risky.

Police officers always try to find ways not to kill the suspect. Deadly force is a last resort and the suspect is the one who dictates the outcome of the situation. Also you clearly have never shot a handgun before much less at distance, with a moving target, while under immense stress. Do you know how hard it is to hit someone's arms or legs? This is not the movies. World's Wildest Police Videos is probably one of the worst TV shows that ever aired because their show is dedicated to showing the craziest things involving police such as police wounding or shooting guns out of people's hands. The problem with constantly showing those videos is people start to think that is the norm and that it isn't hard. Do you know why those videos are on a show called "World's Wildest Police Videos", because they are videos that are incredible, they are "wild", it doesn't happen very often.

Try explaining that to the US cops. They'll tell you that "there's no way to hit a leg/arm" or "it's too dangerous" or "the training is to shoot to the center of mass". Meanwhile our cops (I mean in Russia) somehow manage to aim arms and legs and successfully hit them. 

You know why they tell you that? Because it's true, they don't just pull it out of their ass. Instead of repeating myself I will just refer you to my reply to Zarezhu.

Its rare to see a cop that's willing to risk their life for a suspect....A cop that CAN shoot but doesn't is 100x the police officer compared to a cop that shoots the first chance he gets.

Every comment you leave on these threads are always about how "rare" it is to see good cops or cops that handle situations correctly. Where do you get this information? How many cops do you know? How often are you out on the street along side cops observing what they do? It is actually starting to piss me off because I spent 3 years on the street with deputies, I saw the things they did on a daily basis and I know that every single thing you have said is 100% false. And your little "100x the officer" comment is complete bullshit. It is easy for you to say that behind your keyboard but go put yourself in a deadly force situation then come back and tell me about how an officer who shoots is less of a cop than one who doesn't. Be honest with me, how old are you? Because I really really want to chalk up your ridiculous comments to you just being young and inexperienced as opposed to completely stupid.

 

Every comment you leave on these threads are always about how "rare" it is to see good cops or cops that handle situations correctly. Where do you get this information? How many cops do you know? How often are you out on the street along side cops observing what they do? It is actually starting to piss me off because I spent 3 years on the street with deputies, I saw the things they did on a daily basis and I know that every single thing you have said is 100% false. And your little "100x the officer" comment is complete bullshit. It is easy for you to say that behind your keyboard but go put yourself in a deadly force situation then come back and tell me about how an officer who shoots is less of a cop than one who doesn't. Be honest with me, how old are you? Because I really really want to chalk up your ridiculous comments to you just being young and inexperienced as opposed to completely stupid.

"All the cops I know are great people" is not evidence. There are SO many stories nationwide of police officers shooting suspects that are mentally ill, unarmed, and often minorities. I could link you to a whole bunch of scientific evidence and research, but would you really listen to them? All the facts are in, you're the one not willing to listen. You're living in a bubble. You want to look up to cops as infallible authority figures. Police officers are public officials paid to keep us safe. So YES, a cop that has the training or intellect to realize that he doesn't have to kill someone is a much better law enforcement officer. Protect and serve doesn't stop when a suspect resists. Wanting cops to be better at keeping us safe isn't controversial.

I see you're from Germany. How many people have German police killed? How many people have American police killed this year alone?

 

And pardon my french, but fuck off with your condescending attitude. Is this really going to be a pissing contest to see who's older? Ironically, that's incredibly childish.

Edited July 13, 201510 yr by Riley24

"All the cops I know are great people" is not evidence. There are SO many stories nationwide of police officers shooting suspects that are mentally ill, unarmed, and often minorities. I could link you to a whole bunch of scientific evidence and research, but would you really listen to them? All the facts are in, you're the one not willing to listen. You're living in a bubble. You want to look up to cops as infallible authority figures. Police officers are public officials paid to keep us safe. So YES, a cop that has the training or intellect to realize that he doesn't have to kill someone is a much better law enforcement officer. Protect and serve doesn't stop when a suspect resists. Wanting cops to be better at keeping us safe isn't controversial.

I see you're from Germany. How many people have German police killed? How many people have American police killed this year alone?

 

And pardon my french, but fuck off with your condescending attitude. Is this really going to be a pissing contest to see who's older? Ironically, that's incredibly childish.

I never said that all the cops I know are great people. And out of all those stories of officers shooting people how many of them are justified? Almost all of them. That goes to show that the police are doing the right thing, people just don't want to accept that mentally ill and unarmed people can still be dangerous. If you have scientific evidence then I would love to see it, but I have a feeling that it doesn't exist. Please tell me what what training or experience you have to say what makes a better cop? And no I am not from Germany I just live here, I am from the U.S. born and raised. Nope I don't care how much older I am than you, I couldn't care less.

I never said that all the cops I know are great people. And out of all those stories of officers shooting people how many of them are justified? Almost all of them. That goes to show that the police are doing the right thing, people just don't want to accept that mentally ill and unarmed people can still be dangerous. If you have scientific evidence then I would love to see it, but I have a feeling that it doesn't exist. Please tell me what what training or experience you have to say what makes a better cop? And no I am not from Germany I just live here, I am from the U.S. born and raised. Nope I don't care how much older I am than you, I couldn't care less.

They're justified if your qualifications for justification are that the cop was scared.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2014/08/15/how-the-number-of-justified-police-homicides-has-changed-since-the-1990s/

Please take a look at some of the research posted here. Violent crime and officer fatalities are decreasing, and fatal police shootings are rising. 

 

 Please tell me what what training or experience you have to say what makes a better cop? 

The fact that I'm an American taxpayer and a little bit of common sense. We pay them to take risks, they have a dangerous job. They don't get to gun down everyone that can pose a threat to them, that's not how it works in other countries and we should be no different.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FV53jLDlRQ

Is a mentally ill man holding a screwdriver dangerous? Maybe. Does it warrant him being killed? Absolutely not. It's really that simple.