1 hour ago, Hystery said:

Yeah, there are Islamic extremists in the world. Just like there are Christian extremists, Jew extremists, so on so forth. But you arbitrary decided to focus on islamic ones.

Yeah, there are bits of violence in the Qu'ran (even though the book isn't entirely based on this as there are plenty of passages talking about peace of mind and body, helping hand, etc), just like in other holy books of the other main religions around the globe. But you arbitrary decided to focus on the Qu'ran.

Yeah, there are countries run by extremists who try to rule with a very barbaric approach of Islam over their people. But I don't see how it's your business to deal with that, unless you want another rendition of the Irak war (we all saw what pathetic results it gave for the geopolitical situation in middle-east).

3

I focus on what's relevant. The most dangerous and prevalent extremists in the world today are Islamic extremists. There are no "peaceful" passages of the Quran. It's all about worshipping Allah and doing his bidding. Islam doesn't command its followers to love others, lend a helping hand, and treat others with kindness like Christianity does. Islam is about absolute submission without question or hesitation.

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I don't think it gives anyone an excuse to slaughter millions of people based on their religion (Judaism and Islam in those cases), but I'm not christian so what do I know about massive genocides. In the end there will always be an excuse to say "No but Islam is worse so it's bad." because you arbitrary decided that this was the enemy, even though it isn't.

The slaughter was in response to Islamic aggression. They brought the deaths upon themselves, and rightfully so. People aren't the enemy, ideology is the enemy. Islam is that ideology.

 

18 minutes ago, TheDivineHustle said:

I focus on what's relevant. The most dangerous and prevalent extremists in the world today are Islamic extremists. There are no "peaceful" passages of the Quran. It's all about worshipping Allah and doing his bidding. Islam doesn't command its followers to love others, lend a helping hand, and treat others with kindness like Christianity does. Islam is about absolute submission without question or hesitation.

 

Then I can only suggest you to make your own research because claiming this is blatant ignorance. An ignorance that brings misconception, misunderstanding and ultimately leads to hate. But I doubt you'll do so. As I said, there will always be a good excuse (or scapegoat) to arbitrary target Muslims. 

 

I'll just say one thing: you, who's a proud American, should most likely stand by the values of freedom and constitutional rights. Like the freedom and right to have guns, or to speak your mind. Whether you like it or not, there's also the freedom and right to practice any religion. Your best bet is to deal with it and learn to live with the fact you will have to live with things you don't agree with, and let people worship whatever god they want. Because your God, and your religion, objectively aren't better or worse than any other. 

14 hours ago, TheDivineHustle said:

I challenge you to show me some scripture of the Quran that can help prove your point that they’re not violent. All you seem to be doing here is pointing the finger at something else as a double-standard.

 

I've been on and off in this thread, but are you legitimately asking for proof that not all Muslims are violent, or are you referring to religion?  Either way, you're wrong.  There has never been an entire race of people that were all bad people, nor has there been a religion where every single member was a terrible person.  (Excluding cults, because that's completely off topic)  I honestly find it baffling that you're trying so hard to talk down on religion, but in the process, talking down about the people that follow it.  I'm as anti religious as they come, but even I wouldn't go that far.  You can think they are crazy as fuck, brainwashed individuals for believing in a religion, but you cannot accurately say anything about all of them in terms of their personality.

 

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The Lord commands us, Christians, to educate people on his word and allow the final decision to be up to the individual. He does not want us to force our religion on others, and that’s where Islam and Christianity split. Any Christian that forces Christianity on you is in violation of the Lords will, and they'll answer for that when they die. Because that's not what God wants us to do as Christians.

 

Ah, so door to door religious people are only "educating people on his word"?  As Will point out, the US's anthem includes god, our money includes it, our law enforcement, everything includes Christianity in some way.  Is this part of "the lord's command"?  It's funny how religion is forced upon everyone in the US even if people aren't aware of it.  In school, I got in trouble because I refused to say the pledge, primarily because of the "under god" part.  I don't believe in this garbage, I'm not going to say it.  Funny how schools, and even as an adult, people will throw a fit if you refuse to say the pledge or support the national anthem.  Granted, some of them might be extremely patriotic who aren't thinking about the religious part of it, but you get my point.  religion was drilled into everyone from a young age by something in life.  Christianity was just as much forced as every other religion is in their countries.  You can't tell me Christianity is "innocent" or "better".

 

Lets remember something, Christianity teaches hate towards homosexuals and lesbians.  There's no defending that or rewording the bible to suit a defense.  Christianity says it's a sin, thus, a vast majority of Christians are against homosexuals and believe they should die.  They believe someone who used their free will to make their own choice in who they love is wrong, and they should suffer for it.  Ironic, isn't it, that the bible says god gave free will, but only if he finds it appropriate.  Point is, no religion is "better" or "less evil", and the people are not the problem, it's religion.

16 hours ago, Hystery said:

 

They must have missed that part in the Bible when they launched the crusades and slaughtered millions of jews and muslims then.

  The Christians responded and started the Crusades after learning word of mass Genocide that the Muslims were committing in the whole of the middle east and north Africa.  

 

You really need to learn history before you speak of it.

 

Islam has never and will never preach peace because the Qur'an does not preach peace.

8 hours ago, Giordano said:

 Lets remember something, Christianity teaches hate towards homosexuals and lesbians.  There's no defending that or rewording the bible to suit a defense.  Christianity says it's a sin, thus, a vast majority of Christians are against homosexuals and believe they should die. 

 

1

That depends entirely on which Christian denomination you speak to. Some believe that homosexuality is a choice, some believe that it is a mental disorder, some believe that you're born homosexual and therefore it isn't considered a sin unless homosexual acts or desires are prevalent. That's a theological subject that's up for debate within the different sectors of Christianity. No denomination is taught to hate homosexuals, and any Christian that hates anything/anyone is in contradiction with the Lord's word, which is to love ALL. I personally believe that it is wrong and it is a sin; and will be dealt with accordingly by God.

 

You've also got the numbers wrong. A vast majority of Americans identify as being Christian, yet simultaneously a vast majority of Americans support gay marriage. Most Christians can't believe that homosexuals should die if essentially most Americans support gay marriage, and most Americans are Christians.

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I've been on and off in this thread, but are you legitimately asking for proof that not all Muslims are violent, or are you referring to religion?  Either way, you're wrong.  There has never been an entire race of people that were all bad people, nor has there been a religion where every single member was a terrible person.  (Excluding cults, because that's completely off topic)  I honestly find it baffling that you're trying so hard to talk down on religion, but in the process, talking down about the people that follow it.  I'm as anti religious as they come, but even I wouldn't go that far.  You can think they are crazy as fuck, brainwashed individuals for believing in a religion, but you cannot accurately say anything about all of them in terms of their personality.

2

I'm asking for you to provide me with some sort of material evidence that Islam is, indeed, a religion of peace. I've said numerous times now that just because a Muslim isn't violent, doesn't mean that they don't silently condone acts of violence by other Muslims. Islam is an aggressive, vicious, brutal religion. It has no place in the world, period.

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Ah, so door to door religious people are only "educating people on his word"?

Yes. It's no different a concept than girl scouts going door to door selling cookies.

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As Will point out, the US's anthem includes god, our money includes it, our law enforcement, everything includes Christianity in some way.  Is this part of "the lord's command"?  It's funny how religion is forced upon everyone in the US even if people aren't aware of it. 

  You can't tell me Christianity is "innocent" or "better".

 

Most Christians don't necessarily believe that Christianity should be implemented into our system of government, but when it is, Christians aren't going to complain about it. Removing a few words from various parts of our government isn't going to affect the faith that Christians have. Christians would like it to remain but if it changes, we won't be hurt by it.

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In school, I got in trouble because I refused to say the pledge, primarily because of the "under god" part.  I don't believe in this garbage, I'm not going to say it.  Funny how schools, and even as an adult, people will throw a fit if you refuse to say the pledge or support the national anthem.  Granted, some of them might be extremely patriotic who aren't thinking about the religious part of it, but you get my point.  religion was drilled into everyone from a young age by something in life.  Christianity was just as much forced as every other religion is in their countries.

You have every right to remain silent during the entire pledge if you choose to do so... and others have every right to call you out on it and criticize you for it. The school does not have the right to take disciplinary action against you for it.

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They believe someone who used their free will to make their own choice in who they love is wrong, and they should suffer for it.  Ironic, isn't it, that the bible says god gave free will, but only if he finds it appropriate.  Point is, no religion is "better" or "less evil", and the people are not the problem, it's religion.

That's a completely different theological discussion that I'm not going to partake in right now.

 

18 hours ago, TheDivineHustle said:

The slaughter was in response to Islamic aggression. They brought the deaths upon themselves, and rightfully so. People aren't the enemy, ideology is the enemy. Islam is that ideology.

 

So the mass slaughtering of Jews is okay because Islam is violent? I'm sorry, what?

 

The people practicing Judaism brought their deaths upon themselves because Islam is a violent religion. That is what you are saying.

3 minutes ago, willpv23 said:

 

So the the mass slaughtering of Jews is okay because Islam is violent? I'm sorry, what?

 

The people practicing Judaism brought their death upon themselves because Islam is a violent religion. That is what you are saying.

No, it was not OK. Following the events of the slaughtering, church leaders actually condemned the violence.

11 minutes ago, TheDivineHustle said:

No, it was not OK. Following the events of the slaughtering, church leaders actually condemned the violence.

 

And Muslims do  not  condemn the  violence. Pope Francis himself even says not to associate Islam with violence.

 

(Links for Muslims condemning violence taken from a document in Google Sheets with 6065 lines of links)

On 3/18/2018 at 3:29 PM, TheDivineHustle said:

You’re free to be Muslim, but don’t share your Quran with me and don’t talk about Sharia Law. Last I heard, those of you in Europe were having some issues with that stuff. 

I like how you don't want Muslims shouldn't share their Qu'ran with you, as if you are somewhat regularly approached by Muslims asking if you want to hear the word of Allah? You are free to not care about their religion, but their religion is free to practice it and this whole discussion came about after a user mentioned banning all 1.8 Billion Muslims.

 

As for your whole comment of, don't share your Quran with me... I guess you also support the removal of 'In God We Trust' from the Dollar, because as you say - people shouldn't be pushing religion in other peoples faces, especially if they don't agree with the religion.

2 hours ago, TheDivineHustle said:

That depends entirely on which Christian denomination you speak to. Some believe that homosexuality is a choice, some believe that it is a mental disorder, some believe that you're born homosexual and therefore it isn't considered a sin unless homosexual acts or desires are prevalent.

 

So what you're saying is that according to Christians, homosexual people aren't sinners if they don't show that they're homosexual (because it shouldn't be prevalent). Ah, such a religion of acceptance and peace, to tell people to repress who they are even if that means hurting themselves psychologically in the process.

 

2 hours ago, TheDivineHustle said:

No denomination is taught to hate homosexuals, and any Christian that hates anything/anyone is in contradiction with the Lord's word, which is to love ALL.

You're wrong.

 

“If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

 

Your holy book teaches to kill homosexuals. It's written, right there. Therefore, your God doesn't love all, and on top of that, gets the luxury to tell its believers to slaughter people. Again, such a religion of acceptance and peace.

 

2 hours ago, TheDivineHustle said:

Yes. It's no different a concept than girl scouts going door to door selling cookies.

 

It is different, because you're pushing your beliefs onto people by doing that. I don't want some christian to ring at my door to tell me his God wants me in, because I don't care about it, and yet here they are trying to lure me in even though I don't want to. It's intrusive, and it's no different than what you think muslims are doing.

 

2 hours ago, TheDivineHustle said:

Islam is an aggressive, vicious, brutal religion. It has no place in the world, period.

 

Neither does Christianity then, because there are plenty of aggressive, vicious, brutal verses in the Bible (as seen just above). But again, double standards, trying to find scapegoats to target muslims arbitrarily, all that.

Edited March 19, 20188 yr by Hystery

3 hours ago, willpv23 said:

 

And Muslims do  not  condemn the  violence. Pope Francis himself even says not to associate Islam with violence.

 

(Links for Muslims condemning violence taken from a document in Google Sheets with 6065 lines of links)

I'm not Catholic, so what Pope Francis has to say isn't relevant to me at all. I don't recognize him as being relevant towards my connection with God.

3 hours ago, Ben said:

 

As for your whole comment of, don't share your Quran with me... I guess you also support the removal of 'In God We Trust' from the Dollar, because as you say - people shouldn't be pushing religion in other peoples faces, especially if they don't agree with the religion.

I honestly don't care what's on our currency, and I think I speak on behalf of most other Christians. If they want to remove 'In God We Trust', then they can go ahead and do that.

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I like how you don't want Muslims shouldn't share their Qu'ran with you, as if you are somewhat regularly approached by Muslims asking if you want to hear the word of Allah? You are free to not care about their religion, but their religion is free to practice it and this whole discussion came about after a user mentioned banning all 1.8 Billion Muslims.

They are free to practice their religion, so long as it does not impede the freedoms and liberties of other Americans.

1 hour ago, Hystery said:

It is different, because you're pushing your beliefs onto people by doing that. I don't want some christian to ring at my door to tell me his God wants me in, because I don't care about it, and yet here they are trying to lure me in even though I don't want to. It's intrusive, and it's no different than what you think muslims are doing.

A Christian knocking on your door isn't pushing their beliefs on you. It's literally no different than a political flyer or a Chinese restaurant's menu. If you believe that someone hanging something on your door is aggressive, then I would highly suggest that you never decide to purchase and own a home.

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Neither does Christianity then, because there are plenty of aggressive, vicious, brutal verses in the Bible (as seen just above). But again, double standards, trying to find scapegoats to target muslims arbitrarily, all that.

Most of those so-called "aggressive, vicious, brutal" verses are direct consequences for acts of evil, in which I've addressed all of them.

1 hour ago, Hystery said:

So what you're saying is that according to Christians, homosexual people aren't sinners if they don't show that they're homosexual (because it shouldn't be prevalent). Ah, such a religion of acceptance and peace, to tell people to repress who they are even if that means hurting themselves psychologically in the process.

According to certain denominations of Christianity, yes. Under those particular denominations, being homosexual in and of itself isn't a sin, but having homosexual temptations or committing homosexual acts are sinful. It all varies from the different denominations.

 

3 hours ago, willpv23 said:

 

And Muslims do  not  condemn the  violence. Pope Francis himself even says not to associate Islam with violence.

 

(Links for Muslims condemning violence taken from a document in Google Sheets with 6065 lines of links)

I'm not Catholic, so what Pope Francis has to say isn't relevant to me at all. I don't recognize him as being relevant towards my connection with God.

2 hours ago, Ben said:

 

As for your whole comment of, don't share your Quran with me... I guess you also support the removal of 'In God We Trust' from the Dollar, because as you say - people shouldn't be pushing religion in other peoples faces, especially if they don't agree with the religion.

I honestly don't care what's on our currency, and I think I speak on behalf of most other Christians. If they want to remove 'In God We Trust', then they can go ahead and do that.

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I like how you don't want Muslims shouldn't share their Qu'ran with you, as if you are somewhat regularly approached by Muslims asking if you want to hear the word of Allah? You are free to not care about their religion, but their religion is free to practice it and this whole discussion came about after a user mentioned banning all 1.8 Billion Muslims.

They are free to practice their religion, so long as it does not impede the freedoms and liberties of other Americans.

48 minutes ago, Hystery said:

It is different, because you're pushing your beliefs onto people by doing that. I don't want some christian to ring at my door to tell me his God wants me in, because I don't care about it, and yet here they are trying to lure me in even though I don't want to. It's intrusive, and it's no different than what you think muslims are doing.

A Christian knocking on your door isn't pushing their beliefs on you. It's literally no different than a political flyer or a Chinese restaurant's menu. If you believe that someone hanging something on your door is aggressive, then I would highly suggest that you never decide to purchase and own a home.

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Neither does Christianity then, because there are plenty of aggressive, vicious, brutal verses in the Bible (as seen just above). But again, double standards, trying to find scapegoats to target muslims arbitrarily, all that.

Most of those so-called "aggressive, vicious, brutal" verses are direct consequences for acts of evil, in which I've addressed all of them.

56 minutes ago, Hystery said:

So what you're saying is that according to Christians, homosexual people aren't sinners if they don't show that they're homosexual (because it shouldn't be prevalent). Ah, such a religion of acceptance and peace, to tell people to repress who they are even if that means hurting themselves psychologically in the process.

According to certain denominations of Christianity, yes. Under those particular denominations, being homosexual in and of itself isn't a sin, but having homosexual temptations or committing homosexual acts are sinful. It all varies from the different denominations. I believe that homosexuality is a mental disorder.

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You're wrong.

 

“If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

 

Your holy book teaches to kill homosexuals. It's written, right there. Therefore, your God doesn't love all, and on top of that, gets the luxury to tell its believers to slaughter people. Again, such a religion of acceptance and peace

 

Leviticus was written in the Old Testament, which was before Jesus Christ came down to Earth. Jesus Christ died on the cross so that we can ask the Lord to forgive us for our sins. Before Jesus died, the consequences of sin were merciless and the Lord was unforgiving. Jesus died so that we can ask the Lord for forgiveness, rather than be stoned and sent straight to hell.

40 minutes ago, TheDivineHustle said:

They are free to practice their religion, so long as it does not impede the freedoms and liberties of other Americans.

 

 IT DOESN'T.

3 minutes ago, Hystery said:

 

 IT DOESN'T.

Kinda does, friend.

1 hour ago, TheDivineHustle said:

Kinda does, friend.

 

Did muslims come to you to tell you to stop worshipping your god? To stop shaving and let your beard grow? To pray at the mosque? To stop speaking your mind? To make your girlfriend wear a cloth on her head?

 

Do they prevent you from eating the food you want? Or from drinking alcohol? Do they try to assault you with Qu'ran books in an alleyway? Do they try to overthrow your government? To rule your country with their religion? Do they try to make you speak arabic? Or to wear a djellaba?

 

No? They don't do any of this?

 

Then they don't impede your freedoms or rights. Nor do they impede the freedoms or rights of any other American.

Edited March 19, 20188 yr by Hystery

1 hour ago, Hystery said:

 

Did muslims come to you to tell you to stop worshipping your god? To stop shaving and let your beard grow? To pray at the mosque? To stop speaking your mind? To make your girlfriend wear a cloth on her head?

 

Do they prevent you from eating the food you want? Or from drinking alcohol? Do they try to assault you with Qu'ran books in an alleyway? Do they try to overthrow your government? To rule your country with their religion? Do they try to make you speak arabic? Or to wear a djellaba?

 

No? They don't do any of this?

 

Then they don't impede your freedoms or rights. Nor do they impede the freedoms or rights of any other American.

  Actually, there are force's in the U.S. that are trying actively to make sharia law legal and enforceable.  I know for a fact that in my state they attempted this and it failed.  In Texas they attempted it on a local level and it was rejected.

 

  So yes, there are Muslims that are trying to make everyone do everything that you mentioned.  If they were to succeed, then they would impede upon the freedoms and right's of everyone.

 

I am extremely curious and must ask this question. 

 

Have any of you ever been to the middle east where the Qur'an is the law? 

And I am not talking about the tourist sections of the country's that employ it as there law's but the real parts of the places.

21 minutes ago, ToeBius said:

  Actually, there are force's in the U.S. that are trying actively to make sharia law legal and enforceable.  I know for a fact that in my state they attempted this and it failed.  In Texas they attempted it on a local level and it was rejected.

 

  So yes, there are Muslims that are trying to make everyone do everything that you mentioned.  If they were to succeed, then they would impede upon the freedoms and right's of everyone.

 

The only thing I find when Googling "Texas sharia law" are articles saying that Texas passed an anti-sharia law (which is already a thing in many places in the world and just makes sense as religious laws and civil laws shouldn't be mixed) and a Breitbart article that has been debunked as fake. So I wouldn't mind having trustworthy sources about Muslims "attempting to make sharia law legal on a local level". 

2 hours ago, Hystery said:

 

Did muslims come to you to tell you to stop worshipping your god? To stop shaving and let your beard grow? To pray at the mosque? To stop speaking your mind? To make your girlfriend wear a cloth on her head?

 

Do they prevent you from eating the food you want? Or from drinking alcohol? Do they try to assault you with Qu'ran books in an alleyway? Do they try to overthrow your government? To rule your country with their religion? Do they try to make you speak arabic? Or to wear a djellaba?

 

No? They don't do any of this?

 

Then they don't impede your freedoms or rights. Nor do they impede the freedoms or rights of any other American.

The ideology in and of itself is an impediment to freedom and liberty. It's not what they have done, but what the ideology advocates to be done.

On 3/16/2018 at 7:25 PM, TheDivineHustle said:

Statistically speaking, those that show less prejudice towards Islam tend to know less about Islam. As they become more educated on Islam, they begin to be more unfavorable of it. Funny how that works, huh.

>statistically speaking

 

Trust me, Islamic scholars are very well educated.  They love Allah (subhanahu wa ta'ala) with all their heart.  Please, read in to the context of 'kill all non-believers', and you may be thoroughly surprised.  For your information, I am a devout Roman Catholic and am opposed to the ideology as well, but it is not one of violence.

 

PS:  Also, let me pose a question to you - is freedom always a good idea?

Edited March 20, 20188 yr by CathbolBagel

2 minutes ago, CathbolBagel said:

>statistically speaking

 

Trust me, Islamic scholars are very well educated.  They love Allah (subhanahu wa ta'ala) with all their heart.  Please, read in to the context of 'kill all non-believers', and you may be thoroughly surprised.  For your information, I am a devout Roman Catholic and am opposed to the ideology as well, but it is not one of violence.

 

PS:  Also, let me pose a question to you - is freedom always a good idea?

  Yes freedom is "ALWAYS" a Great idea.  Without freedom you are no more than a slave.

 

Life

Liberty

And the Pursuit of Happiness

5 minutes ago, CathbolBagel said:

>statistically speaking

 

Trust me, Islamic scholars are very well educated.  They love Allah (subhanahu wa ta'ala) with all their heart.  Please, read in to the context of 'kill all non-believers', and you may be thoroughly surprised.  For your information, I am a devout Roman Catholic and am opposed to the ideology as well, but it is not one of violence.

4

I don't quite understand how the context can be any different. It seems like a rather straight-forward command from Allah.

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PS:  Also, let me pose a question to you - is freedom always a good idea?

I would say it is, and the founding fathers of this country would also agree, evidently. Freedom is an amazing thing, it's truly beautiful.