93 replies to this topic

[KevinDV]

Recently I've said it in a number of areas, yet I get no response. I want a answer as to why stolen/modifications with false crediting or none at all are being approved and then no action taken against the individuals responsible?

Also, another thing that I've noticed lately is the featuring of new modifications that is also being neglected, many users upload excellent work and then it is not featured, a good example is corleone's German Vito, Cj24's recent Charger and Impala, and tons of other qualifying modifications. I just want to know why some mods are featured for weeks at a time and others neglected?

[Revan]

I'm curious, What mods are stolen?

[Tom H]

I can understand your point of view, but without evidence from the original owner, the staff are powerless. They don't know who is in the right and who is in the wrong.

[Break]

First of all, the reason we approve mods that might not be correctly credited etc are, because we simply don't have the staff power to check EVERY download for the rightness of credits and permission and such. We rely on the authors to tell us when their work is being used without authorisation, as if we sat there, checking every model if it has been uploaded somewhere else it'd take us ages to get through all the approval requests we get daily. Our main function in the downloads section is to prevent viruses, porn pics or other shit being uploaded; and then to solve any problems that arise if a modder discovers one of his models has been uploaded without permission or credits.
We'd really like to help everyone out and we're always on the side of the modder if his mods gets stolen. And if a modder approaches us or files a report, giving us clear evidence of a "mod theft", which means linking us to the model which has been uploaded somewhere else before here, under different credits and we're able to actually open the two models in OpenIV and compare them, we will do all we can to resolve the issue. (Which usually means PM'ing the "thief" and disabling his mod, then usually deleting it). If nothing is done, that's because no report has been filed or there's no evidence. Anybody could say "hey, that a**hole stole!", which is why we can't do anything without evidence. And in all honestly, if you go around calling other modders "thiefs" and insulting them, without having any bit of evidence, that could be considered flaming, which is not wanted here (See first point "Abuse" in the Community Guidelines). If you know somebody stole, it's better to shut up, collect evidence, file a nice and polite report and wait for us to deal with it; if you want to be really effective, go look for the author of the mod and ask him to come here to file the report or send Jay an E-Mail -- I can promise you we deal with this stuff.

About the other thing, the feature button is actioned by the staff and since there's been a major seepage to FCRP lately not many of the staff look at the downloads to set a featured download. In all honesty, I think Jay should code something that sets a mod featured according to a certain algorithm. I'll try to feature mods more often, if I get time to, okay?

But now, I'd like to tell you, that sometimes this disrespect originating from some modders and community members really makes me sick. We deal with enough stuff a day and it's very disrespectful to write a post like this and leave us standing there like we're some kind of lazy fucks who don't do anything, but playing with their balls all day. We all have our private lives and in our free time we sit in front of the computer and try to solve problems of other people. We do this absolutely for free, when we could spend time with friends or with the loved one or we could just sleep a bit longer. I'm very sorry if the downloads section is a bit short under administration, but the forum, with the ammount of posts we get a day is a big priority aswell, however I will try to get to the downloads section more often. I'd just like to ask these people and sadly you too, Kevin, for a minimum amount of respect towards the work we do, since it's a completely free service and yet I don't think we do it that badly.

[KevinDV]

I'm not disrespecting anyone, I simply want answers. How would you feel if you ask and are ignored?

It pains me to see stolen crap in the downloads sections and I'm powerless, I'm obviously not going to do research into every stolen mod I see because its actually general knowledge as to what is stolen and what isn't. In all honesty, you could do a better job at approvals. I'm sick of seeing stolen mods.

Here is a damn good example: http://www.lcpdfr.co...n-200sx-police/

No crediting at all, yet its approved? Hmmm...

[Break]

Does my reply look like I'm ignoring anyone here? I could be studying right now, yet I sit here and answer to this thread, whose point is merely to make us moderators look bad. I don't ignore anyone here, I try to get to every single complaint or wish you guys have, so don't treat me like I'm some kind of asshole.
I understand you're pissed, but there's no reason to be as disrespectful as you are right now.

Just so you understand, we can't just not approve a mod because it's got no credits. It could be the author uploading who just didn't decide to include credits, which would mean we'd have to look for the original model (which can take a while), compare both, then write a PM and disable the mod. It's just not effective. Even though the policy is, that only authors can report a mod stolen, I will give you a one chance opportunity:

You may go through the whole downloads section and file a report for each mod that shouldn't be there, but please include a link to the original model. I'll deal with it personally then. If you want to be helpful you can even load up the models in some sort of displaying program like OpenIV or Zmod and make screenshots comparing them. That'd save me time.

We're willing to help everyone here, but unfortunately we just don't have the manpower to do it all by ourselves and we rely on a helpful community that helps us do our job and doesn't expect everything to come like magic. And I don't mean that you guys have to moderate the forums or anything, just give us a headsup to stuff that's happening, if no one is taking care of it. In the case of modifications that's a bit more work (as we need evidence), yet I think it's doable if "it pains (you)" that much to see stolen modifications.

[NicolaiB]

Kevin, I understand what you are saying, but it's not a simple issue

We can't check each mod to see if it's stolen some modders are uploading to several sites, some are using different names. Also, we don't have the time to do so.


We do take mod theft seriously, but we won't take action when it's word against word, we take swift action when someone presents evidence of the mod in question being stolen, we have to give users the benefit of the doubt if there's no proof, we won't tolerate mod theft, we have previously taken action when screening the mods that are pending approval.

It's a very difficult subject, it's not as straight forward as you may think it is, the CT keeps itself to a high standard when it comes to situations like that, we won't take action based on suspicion, we need evidence before we will take action, it's unfair to do so otherwise.

If any member sees anything in the downloads section they believe to be stolen, find a link to the stolen item from the original source and file a report, we will make sure that the matter will be dealt with when we have the time to do so, just keep in mind that the site is growing, and modders might use different names on each site.


You are not really in a position to complain if you state that it pains you to see mods being stolen, but can't be arsed with doing the leg work yourself, you as a modder should understand how it would feel if you found one of your mods being stolen, so you of all people should want to do something about the situation.

[KevinDV]

Well, heres a few, many of these mods are taken from authors such as Bxbugs123 and
Lt.Caine, they are not allowed to be redistributed without permission; therefore, its used without
permission and can be considered stolen.

Just understand one thing, I'm not attacking anyone, I simply want a bit of more order
when it comes to modification approvals, I get very paranoid if I see a mod that is obviously
stolen that has been approved that also contains no credits, it isn't my job to report that
when I never approved it in the first place.

One of the big issues with crediting is with the people who make packs, we get annoyed if our
work is used without permission, people throw it all in a pack and upload it with false credits.
______________________________________________________________________
http://www.lcpdfr.co...-sheriff-truck/

Lt.Caine's Biff Ambulance, no credits, violation of Lt.Caine's readme.

Original: http://www.gtapolice...?do=file&id=456

______________________________________________________________________
http://www.lcpdfr.co...nce-and-engine/

Lt.Caine's Steed Ambulance, no credits, violation of Lt.Caine's readme.

Ambulance: http://www.lcpdfr.co...nce-and-engine/

Firetruck: http://gtapolicemods...do=file&id=1321 (gtapolicetrucker's)

______________________________________________________________________
http://www.lcpdfr.co...epartment-pack/

No credits, 2 CVPIs by Bxbugs, other by aznairsoftdude, Violation of readmes.

http://gtapolicemods...do=file&id=1297

http://www.lcpdfr.co...y-city-pd-cvpi/

http://gtapolicemods...?do=file&id=818
______________________________________________________________________
http://www.lcpdfr.co...ga-police-pack/

No crediting, no other original links available.

http://gtapolicemods.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=1298

______________________________________________________________________

http://www.lcpdfr.co...n-200sx-police/

No crediting, possibly stolen.

Original:

http://www.gta4-mods...olice-v02-f9237

Contains minimal credits.
______________________________________________________________________

My suggestion would be not to approve mods unless they have credits, that way it would
be much easier for everybody and there would be a standard to abide by.

Edited by KevinDV, 04 June 2012 - 11:29 AM.

[NicolaiB]

I'll go though that list and remove anything that may not comply with the original terms of agreement files.


EDIT: I have processed the list.

Edited by NicolaiB, 04 June 2012 - 12:01 PM.

[St.Kizza]

i have a suggestion that could help to see if models are stolen or not. This might be tricky or maybe impossible to make, but what if creators make a little signature hidden very well on or inside the car and only tell lcpdfr.com staff where it is.
They could look for the signature before approving. If the signature is there but it doesnt match with the one whom trying to upload it they can ask the creator if he/she has approved the upload.

Example: KevinDV has made a car and uploaded it on say GPM or another modding site or where-ever. Then i download it and try to upload it here. Staff members can check the autensity of it by checking for the signature. If its there they ask KevinDV if he has approved the upload. If not, Staff members take contact with me and let me know that i have earned x amount of warningpoints. If i get x amount more it will eventually result in a ban.

[Tom H]

BXBugs123, already does that. he has his name engraved pretty small on the dashboard.

The problem with that is each download has to be checked thoroughly for the signature for every upload and the CT don't have the time nor the manpower to do so.

Edited by Tom H, 04 June 2012 - 01:57 PM.

[St.Kizza]

BXBugs123, already does that. he has his name engraved pretty small on the dashboard.

The problem with that is each download has to be checked thoroughly for the signature for every upload and the CT don't have the time nor the manpower to do so.

Ok. Some mad genious should make a program that detects signatures very fast ;-)

Edited by St.Kizza, 04 June 2012 - 02:05 PM.

[Harper]

Ok. Some mad genious should make a program that detects signatures very fast ;-)

Or you could just look through the textures in the .wtd file and see if there's anything relating to a signature in there.

[Tom H]

Or you could just look through the textures in the .wtd file and see if there's anything relating to a signature in there.

But anyone can remove those easily.

[Dhruv]

They could remove even the model part,easily.If they got the guts and components to replace it,that is.

[Tom H]

It would need to be unlocked though.

[Jay]

We were actually inventing a system which allows a model to be encrypted. Like, fully encrypted using a custom encryption algorithm, and still have GTA IV load it thanks to the work of an overlay "IVOverlay".
It would also allow loading changes to core files in a seperate folder, so the user's GTA IV installation wouldn't have to be modified to use mods and it would essentially put an end to any mod stealing. We would also be able to modify core files this way just for LCPDFR.

Although, we currently don't have the time to work on it, with work/university, dealing with moderation stuff, website programming and numerous side-projects we're all working on.

[Dhruv]

It would need to be unlocked though.

If we're talking about a theft,its sure as hell they'd rip it.

[Ofc.Chad]

In some ways I think this could be solved by having a simple Radio Button selection during the upload process two selections: 1. Original Mod by Me, No Other Mods Used (Even have the ability to select a Creative Commons License or Public Domain) 2. This Mod uses other mods which opens up a text box requiring the user to input data. Now if a user says original mod by me and we find out that it's not true, automatic ban. Someone still has to report it, but that's pretty much how it goes down in the real world, but it easily provides some safety.

Side note, the text box could enable "tagging" where you tag another user in the forum which would either link to their page or the original mod itself.

[Tom H]

Not necessarily, most of the links that Kevin listed that had been "Stolen" were just re-uploaded with the user claiming it to be theirs.....

@JAY, that sounds pretty awesome!

Edited by Tom H, 04 June 2012 - 03:32 PM.