66 replies to this topic

[Break]

aGuyProd, on 28 February 2012 - 06:15 PM, said:

You all hating on the Caprice cause you never tried it! I do own a caprice and I have absolutely thrashed it and it still is going! Mine is a 2009 and it has already went 140K kilometers. Very reliable car. I would really like to know the reason for your hating.

Just a thing of tase. I never liked the new caprice from its looks. It doesn't look like a classical american car, it just looks like a crappy chinese c-class knock-off. On top of that, it's normal for a car these days to run more than 140kkm.

[Ad-Robot]

[aGuyProd]

Don't judge a book by it's cover lads =)

[Slimory]

aGuyProd, on 28 February 2012 - 06:15 PM, said:

You all hating on the Caprice cause you never tried it! I do own a caprice and I have absolutely thrashed it and it still is going! Mine is a 2009 and it has already went 140K kilometers. Very reliable car. I would really like to know the reason for your hating.

it's a chevy ;)

[Ridgerunner]

We won't know the durability of these vehicles until they've been out on the road for a good year or two.  Private use and police use are two completely different things.  As an Air Force SP, we were breaking the Chevy Impala's transmissions at around 35K while I'm sure they could under normal conditions go much longer then that.  With the proper maintenance and tlc these vehicles should get some good mileage from them, but you're not paid to exactly "baby" them.  Urban/rural driving will all be factors when individual departments select the models that they'll use.

I don't think it should come to any surprise that any department, especially the MSP, would select the Dodge Chager.  They put all of those models through vigorous testing and the Dodge Chager performed the best.  Dodge has been fine tuning their Charger model for law enforcement for quite some time so it should be expected that their product would perform.  They'll always be pros/cons of any vehicle, but for right now they've decided that the new Dodge Charger fits their requirements the best.

I haven't seen a price tag on the new E7, they said it would be competitive (we'll see).  If they're on the high side. which most likely they will be, I think they'll probably lose a good chunk of the market with big cities.  Cosmetically the vehicle may be lacking but it was designed to be law enforcement friendly inside and for those of us that have used vehicles not designed for law enforcement duties we can really appreciate that.  In fact I've always wondered with such a big market why a law enforcement vehicle hadn't been attempted before.

As for SUV's being used in pursuits, yes they can be used but they do have the drawbacks already covered.  Most likely departments that like them choose them for their interior space and inclement weather handling not effectiveness in a high speed pursuit.

[psycodiver69]

Repairs is another factor, any car you own will break down regardless of how well built it is. Also accidents are very common, I was talking to a tech at the local state trooper garage and he told me they get a car ever week to 2 weeks for hitting just deers, thats not to mention everything else. Police want a car that can be fixed and put right back on the road. CV was easy and cheap to fix. Thats a problem with alot of these cars, they tend to be more complicated to fix. This means more downtime for the vehicle too. They told me their keeping alot of their CVs with lower milage in storage and rotating them when they need them, like when other cars break down.

The charger has a good advantage right now, its been out a while, departments that jumped at them got to find out what works and what doesn't and departments that are now switching to them are learning from what those other departments have done. The caprice has been out for some time also as the G8 and more so as the Holden Caprice in australia, so the knowledge is behind them. I think the taurus and E7 are at the disadvantage, their new cars to the game, yea we know the preformance, but thats one aspect that time on the road can't show.

[aGuyProd]

The Caprice may be a new car on your markets. But in Australia (Rugged country) and the middle east (deserts and scorching temperatures) the Caprice is considered to be the best sedan on the markets. It's Alloytec V6 is well rounded and is kinda punchy, that would cover the pursuits, it's just that you Americans haven't seen it for a decade or more (97' Caprice) and you're shocked that it came out this way in 2012 that's it.

[unr3al]

Break, on 28 February 2012 - 05:50 PM, said:

Oh don't worry, the E7 is built in America and afaik their engines are from the BMW manufacturing facility in Spartanburg, NC :) So, those, except for the brand name BMW are basically american cars. On top of that, BMW gives pretty good price reductions to police departments, and since they have a deal with Carbon Motors, I don't really think replacement parts will be sold too highly priced. These days shipping costs en-masse are so low, it shouldn't be a problem. On top of that, I think if Carbon Motors are smart, they'll order batches of replacement parts and store them in their warehouses, so you don't have to order one piece at a time from BMW in Germany.

Part availability is one thing, but unless they copied a typical American design, BMW parts and repairs are costly, and very difficult to work with. Cars like Mercedes, Porsche and BMW's are beautiful and good performers but they require that you bring them to the dealer for repairs with most problems that can arise during normal use, never mind for pursuits and other stressful work. I find that a lot of German cars are over engineered. Think of it like a Tiger/Panther tank from WWII. Arguably the best tanks out there from the 1940's, but if one small part broke, it was F'ed and couldn't be repaired quickly to be put back into action, and they couldn't build enough of them fast enough because they were too complex. Weapons that won the war were crude, and sometimes could be worse in design, but they were mass manufactures and easily repaired/replaced. Examples would be the horrid American Sherman tank or the PPSH Russian sub machine gun. Stamped parts manufactured on a mass scale, and a design that could work with improvised (MacGyver) repairs.

This is not an insult to any country or something that any one specific auto maker has a problem with, by the way. Many other manufacturers like Lamborghini, Ferrari, Italdesign, and Jaguar (which is now owned by Ford, so you could try and make the same argument about part availability) from many different countries suffer the same problems.

Edited by unr3al, 29 February 2012 - 07:28 AM.